Anyone played the siege project in Stoke?

[Cannonfodder]

I suspect that we are not his target market

I'd say the zombie themed games are usually aimed more towards the stag do or birthday party market and from experience those groups tend to make game days worse rather than better. Combined with an inability to answer simple questions quite frankly I'd rather shit in my hands and clap than give them any money

 

[Sneakyduck]

I find it bizarre that @Sneakyduck wants to build his empire by directly pissing off members of the forum by not answering a very basic question.

It's not particularly entertaining, and I certainly won't be going to the site as a result.

How exactly have I not answered the question. Have you read the full thread?

I suspect that we are not his target market.  Having spent more time than I care to in Stoke, I hate to think who his target market are.

All CQB old and young are my market. Everyone is made welcome and everyone gets a good game, whether they are from Stoke or not.

I'd say the zombie themed games are usually aimed more towards the stag do or birthday party market and from experience those groups tend to make game days worse rather than better. Combined with an inability to answer simple questions quite frankly I'd rather shit in my hands and clap than give them any money

That’s a very strange answer seeing as though you are an avid viewer in my discord page. All information is on there and you know it’s not just about Zombies don’t you as you can see the story lines unfold. As you watch and look at the photos and videos you obviously know about all the love and hard work that’s been poured into the site. Why you were only talking to one or our guys saying about you coming down with 3 others. 

I've thankfully never had that pleasure, but if I do, I'll watch out for Sneakyduck, no doubt dressed up like a little napoleon, wandering around surveying his empire?

No in actual fact I will be hard at work making sure you’ve had the bast game day ever. Listening to your feedback to make the site even better. You know so that I can open more sites to give you all the game days you deserve, you know that kind of empire. 

 

[Colin Allen]

How exactly have I not answered the question.

You have not provided a rationale for limiting HPA to a lower power than other weapons.

 

[Sneakyduck]

You have not provided a rationale for limiting HPA to a lower power than other weapons.

If you care to read back I’m sure you will. Here’s a clue, Joule

Afternoon all.

Has anyone here played, or attended the siege project in Stoke, linked to or run by Sierra airsoft possibly?

I ask as I found out about it and I'm curious as it's not too far away from me but their system doesn't readily give out information so I contacted them and got odd replies that then required additional clarification.

(See pictures)

I asked about site limits and rules as  cqb sites I've played in the past have weight limits for bbs as well as fps limits/joule limits and an evening game is £25 which would be wasted if I couldn't meet rules. 

Is the hap-hazard, almost mis-information, from who ever answered my query likely to reflect the way they run their site?

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It wouldn't be wasted if you had a hot rif then we would do all we could to help you with that, or offer a hire or offer a refund. So no waste.

 

[Sneakyduck]

Seeing as you guys are unwilling to let it go and seem intent on trying to dirty The Siege Projects good name, here’s a little education tool. I use this to explain why my and many other sites restrict HPA and GBB on site. Contrary to conspiracy theories all we’re trying to do is protect YOU the end user, so without further a-due please read on. 
 

What is the Difference Between Joules & FPS

While both joules and FPS can give an indication of your gun’s power, they are measuring different things. FPS is a measure of velocity, changing relative to the weight of a BB – heavier BBs mean less FPS, but this has no bearing on joules.

So, although the FPS of your gun may change depending on the weight of your BB, the level of kinetic energy (joules) it produces should always remain the same – in theory.

What is Joule Creep?

We say ‘in theory’ because there is something known as ‘joule creep’, which refers to how much air is present to push the BB out of the barrel.

The perfect amount of air in the system ensures your BB leaves the barrel with the right amount of joules and energy. Too little air means your BB stops accelerating before it reaches the end of the barrel, losing potential energy. Too much air means your BB will leave the barrel with the proper joule rating, but you will have excess air in the barrel that gets wasted, potentially destabilising the BB and leading to less accuracy.

Although many AEGs experience minimal joule creep, HPAs and GBBRs can see it happen more commonly.

You can counteract excess air by using heavier BBs. This being said, doing so is often against site rules, as when you chrono at the start, you should be doing so with the system setup you intend to use.

To find out more about using a chronograph to test how powerful your gun is, see our guide, which especially helpful for airsoft newbies.

What is airsoft chronograph? 
It is worth noting that it is possible to fire over the limit without intending to. Again, unlikely for AEG users, but it can be seen for HPA and GBBR players. Changes in the temperature can easily affect the gun’s output, often without the player even realising it.

 

[Colin Allen]

Seeing as you guys are unwilling to let it go and seem intent on trying to dirty The Siege Projects good name, here’s a little education tool. I use this to explain why my and many other sites restrict HPA and GBB on site. Contrary to conspiracy theories all we’re trying to do is protect YOU the end user, so without further a-due please read on. 
 

What is the Difference Between Joules & FPS

While both joules and FPS can give an indication of your gun’s power, they are measuring different things. FPS is a measure of velocity, changing relative to the weight of a BB – heavier BBs mean less FPS, but this has no bearing on joules.

So, although the FPS of your gun may change depending on the weight of your BB, the level of kinetic energy (joules) it produces should always remain the same – in theory.

What is Joule Creep?

We say ‘in theory’ because there is something known as ‘joule creep’, which refers to how much air is present to push the BB out of the barrel.

The perfect amount of air in the system ensures your BB leaves the barrel with the right amount of joules and energy. Too little air means your BB stops accelerating before it reaches the end of the barrel, losing potential energy. Too much air means your BB will leave the barrel with the proper joule rating, but you will have excess air in the barrel that gets wasted, potentially destabilising the BB and leading to less accuracy.

Although many AEGs experience minimal joule creep, HPAs and GBBRs can see it happen more commonly.

You can counteract excess air by using heavier BBs. This being said, doing so is often against site rules, as when you chrono at the start, you should be doing so with the system setup you intend to use.

To find out more about using a chronograph to test how powerful your gun is, see our guide, which especially helpful for airsoft newbies.

What is airsoft chronograph? 
It is worth noting that it is possible to fire over the limit without intending to. Again, unlikely for AEG users, but it can be seen for HPA and GBBR players. Changes in the temperature can easily affect the gun’s output, often without the player even realising it.

None of which provides a valid reason for restricting HPA users to a lower power output. 

 

[Sneakyduck]

None of which provides a valid reason for restricting HPA users to a lower power output. 

You my friend are just being argumentative. Less hate more love

 

[Colin Allen]

You my friend are just being argumentative. Less hate more love

I am pointing out that your statements do not validate your approach to HPA; that is not being argumentative.

There is neither love nor hate in this discussion; if you think there is hate, you probably need to become somewhat less sensitive.

 

[Galvatron]

Why should people be willing to let go of misinformation being portrayed as fact?

Nobody here has said that joule creep is akin to Bigfoot or the Yeti. The majority of us are aware of joule creep it that is more prevalent in GBB and HPA. The limit imposed on it by your site is still arbitrary, regardless of the narrative that it's in the interest of safety. One can argue it sends a message that marshals are either disinclined to or incapable of doing adequate chrono checks so one can question what else there is a reluctance or incapacity to do in the name of ensuring safety. There's no obvious mention of liability insurance on the website either.

I've played at games on hot days where the host openly stated it's possible that GBB and HPA players could find their guns running with more energy by midday because of the higher ambient temperature. He didn't tuck his tail between his legs and say HPA and GBB users had to handicap themselves, he had them retest when day time temperatures peaked and had players adjust their guns and retest a second time if they were found to be hot. Nobody bitched about it and they acted honestly.

It's quite the contradiction to point out that GBB and HPA are more subject to joule creep than AEG while only applying a greater cap to HPA.

I've got no dog in this fight as I don't own any GBBRs or HPA guns though I disagree with the rationale of imposing the caps in place against HPA users compared to AEG and GBB.

Might I suggest that when you try to engage with people, you don't dismiss different points of view as "conspiracy theories"? Sometimes you learn more from those with dissenting views than those in an echo chamber.

 

[Sneakyduck]

I am pointing out that your statements do not validate your approach to HPA; that is not being argumentative.

There is neither love nor hate in this discussion; if you think there is hate, you probably need to become somewhat less sensitive.

Ok so you don’t understand the concept joule creep that’s ok.

Why should people be willing to let go of misinformation being portrayed as fact?

Nobody here has said that joule creep is akin to Bigfoot or the Yeti. The majority of us are aware of joule creep it that is more prevalent in GBB and HPA. The limit imposed on it by your site is still arbitrary, regardless of the narrative that it's in the interest of safety. One can argue it sends a message that marshals are either disinclined to or incapable of doing adequate chrono checks so one can question what else there is a reluctance or incapacity to do in the name of ensuring safety. There's no obvious mention of liability insurance on the website either.

I've played at games on hot days where the host openly stated it's possible that GBB and HPA players could find their guns running with more energy by midday because of the higher ambient temperature. He didn't tuck his tail between his legs and say HPA and GBB users had to handicap themselves, he had them retest when day time temperatures peaked and had players adjust their guns and retest a second time if they were found to be hot. Nobody bitched about it and they acted honestly.

It's quite the contradiction to point out that GBB and HPA are more subject to joule creep than AEG while only applying a greater cap to HPA.

I've got no dog in this fight as I don't own any GBBRs or HPA guns though I disagree with the rationale of imposing the caps in place against HPA users compared to AEG and GBB.

Might I suggest that when you try to engage with people, you don't dismiss different points of view as "conspiracy theories"? Sometimes you learn more from those with dissenting views than those in an echo chamber.

I’m sorry but your response is beyond logic. You have no understanding of why sites do what they do or are just plain ignorant or as I say again are just looking for an argument. If you can’t be humble enough to take the point and realise these are the site rules then I can’t help you. 

 

[Colin Allen]

Ok so you don’t understand the concept joule creep that’s ok.

Do you enjoy making yourself appear foolish?

A couple of friends and I carried out experiments on joule creep using AEGs, GBBs and HPAs years ago when we were marshalling at a site and HPA was just becoming a thing.

Joule creep exists; however, its potential negative effects can be managed through proper chronoing procedures, random in-game checking and developing a culture where HPA users are required to reset and lock their systems if the temperature changes.

It seems that you have chosen not to do that, but have chosen to impose an arbitrary rule on HPA users.  Why don't you do the same to GBB users?  Their guns are also susceptible to joule creep.

 

[Galvatron]

I realise they are the site rules. I merely consider them asinine and arbitrary.

The world doesn't owe you understanding. When you accuse people of lacking humility when they have taken the time to express their disagreement, you come across as sanctimonious at best.

It's curious that when you said my response is "beyond logic", you said absolutely nothing to address my point about liability insurance. What else did you skip reading?

 

[Colin Allen]

If you can’t be humble enough to take the point and realise these are the site rules then I can’t help you. 

I suspect that you did not mean that to sound arrogant, but it did.

 

[Dan Robinson]

Imagine coming on an Airsoft forum,  and thinking experienced members with years of standing don't know about Joule Creep and using Joules over FPS for chrono.

 

[Sneakyduck]

Ok so you don’t understand the concept joule creep that’s ok.

I’m sorry but your response is beyond logic. You have no understanding of why sites do what they do or are just plain ignorant or as I say again are just looking for an argument. If you can’t be humble enough to take the point and realise these are the site rules then I can’t help you. 

See even Colin finds you funny

 

[Galvatron]

See even Colin finds you funny

He's laughing at your response and your lack of self-awareness.

 

[Tackle]

@Sneakyduck

I suspect that very long post where you alledgely detail your knowledge of joules/fps vs BB weight etc etc, was actually copied & pasted from another source, but I'll take that as a positive in the hope that you've taken the time to source it,  you'll hopefully absorb some of the info & put it in to practice within your empire. 

As for the rest, I'll wait for someone with a decent reputation within the Airsoft community to give the site a try & hopefully review it afterwards. 

If your doing things right regards to safety, decent Marshalls etc, then I wish you well, all everyone wants is decent well run gamedays that continue to show Airsoft in a positive light. 

 

[Sneakyduck]

I suspect that you did not mean that to sound arrogant, but it did.

I put facts up but you still won’t accept or understand, I’m not surprised you think I sound arrogant. It’s your last line of defence. Cant attack the rule so attack the man.

 

[Dan Robinson]

I put facts up but you still won’t accept or understand, I’m not surprised you think I sound arrogant. It’s your last line of defence. Cant attack the rule so attack the man.

Are you reading the same posts we're all reading?  Nobody is attacking you as a person, only the completely obvious avoidance of answering the question.  Pasting something from a website does nothing to explain the arbitrary limits your site enforces, and shows more that you don't really understand what's going on.

 

[Tackle]

Are you reading the same posts we're all reading?  Nobody is attacking you as a person

I definitely didn't ?

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