The Church of Daytona Gun

I don't even have the m249 yet haha. Got the tank and line though. so I guess that's a start.

 
Don't skimp on the tanks for the M249s. You both want 4500s - 60+ci at a minimum. Those things eat air faster than any kit.

Also, SFRs and wide bores. Anything less and you'll starve them with a poop refresh rate.

 
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Prof,

Could you list what kit you have additional to the actual DG engine kit? Just so I can start to assemble the other components required to build the kit once it's arrived?

 
Sure. This thread might help too: http://www.airsoft-forums.co.uk/index.php/topic/28408-the-daytona-build/

This is for the absolute optimum build. You can get by with other stuff, but DGs are a bit fussy on their air source so I would make sure you have everything:

  • Line
    Single QD, 'wide bore' line
  • Amped, the included Redline SFR line or Beesting lines are fine for this, but you want a single QD
  • No coiled lines

[*]Regulator

  • Higher refresh is better
  • Redline SFR is optimal
  • Firebase (or the Ninja clone of it) is fine, but not optimal

[*]Tank(s)

  • 4500psi
  • 60+ci for most guns
  • Consider a second for an M249 (you will probably need it)
  • I use the Guerrilla 88/4500s to good effect (LordGeorge on here uses the 100ci ones, so you can ask him about those)
  • Consider switching the tank regulators to Ninja Pro V2s as they're the best (people have reported issues with the refresh rate of the Guerrilla Myth G3 so I replaced mine, but have not been able to confirm them as a problem. Can vouch for the Ninja Pro V2s being great though)
  • If you're removing the tank reg, try asking the retailer to so it because it's pretty tricky. If you're doing it by yourself then you need some non-slip mat and an adjustable spanner. A vise is also a good call

[*]DG lube

  • GetSome 1000
  • Buy about 3 of them when you get your kit if you can as it's hard/impossible to source in the EU
  • Needle dropper is best, so buy one needle and then two 4oz pump bottles to just refill the needle with when it runs out (as the pumps are cheaper)
  • Expect to use 2/3 of a bottle for break-in

[*]Regulator lube

  • TechT Gun Sav
  • I prefer the viscous one, but you can use drops if you like)
  • One is enough. One pot lasts for ages

[*]Fill nipple covers
[*]Scuba tank

  • 300bar
  • 10lt
  • Ensure it's in hydro before you buy it or there's no guarantee it'll work
  • You can sometimes source ones that are on their last 5 years of hydro (before they need scrapping) for about £50. Otherwise expect to pay £100-£150
  • Do not buy new

[*]Fill station

  • 4500psi if you're going to use a dive tank
  • DIN is better than Yoke. Most 300bar scuba tanks use DIN (or a screw in Yoke adapter that can be removed)

[*]Misc
[*]Spares

  • Spare set of o-rings
  • Spare crush ring (or Delrin crush ring if you want to fiddle around replacing the rubber one so it doesn't wear as quick)
  • Spare DG bucking
  • Nylon grub screw for the hop is a good idea if you're R-hopping
  • PM me about this. I have a load of spares if you need to buy some without importing



Ok, two extra things. First off, a specific issue with the M249: The grip line is pretty exposed. I fixed this by switching to EU QDs, but that's a whole different story and I won't bore you with it. What you may want to do is use a 6mm ID spring or something to stop the line from kinking. You cannot use the DIGL with the M249 as it won't fit through the bored out bolt that's in the grip (you'll see what I mean when you go to fit the kit).

Second thing is how to route your line and tank is really important if you're new to HPA. When using larger bottles (like the ones the M249 demands) then you will need some sort of pack or large hydration bladder to store it in. I use a WAS cargo pack with straps and LordGeorge uses a hydration bladder - both basically are back packs though. I would not recommend attaching a pack to your molle unless you have a significant counterweight on the front of what you're wearing (otherwise it'll pull your whole chest rig/plate carrier up into your neck as you run).

 
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So if I get the Dye 1.5L 91ci/4500psi tank from bs that comes with the ninja V2 regulator apparently? I'd have to choose fr pro reg v2 or pro reg v2 slp. What's th difference? Guess I'd need to buy the line separately?

Roughly how many bb's would a 1.5 91/4500 get through?

 
Sounds good. Pro V2 has a higher output than the SLP. SLP only has a nominal number of uses and none of those really fit into airsoft unless you use an SLP regulator. It's basically a way of using a cheap regulator as the output is regulated straight out of the tank down to about 300psi (as opposed to the 600-800psi that a regular tank reg puts out). Generally the lower pressure means slower refresh time, but ultimately means you can get away with a regulator built to operate at a far lower input pressure (and therefore is far cheaper).

Basically: SLP won't play all that well with DG as it needs the highest refresh rate of any HPA on the market.

Your line should come with the SFR if you select that option on Beesting (and most retailers also bundle the line with the SFR). Again, ensure you order the single QD line and not the usual double QD. If you need one separately because you've already bought a regulator (or can't find a retailer that's bundling them) then look for Amped, Beesting or Redline branded ones as they use decent fittings.

That tank will probably get you 4000 shots. Break-in I'd expect slightly lower. So long as you bring your Scuba tank with you (and leave it in the car) there shouldn't be any issues with refilling half way through the day.

 
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Great,

That's kinda what I thought.

I'll get the pro V2 for now that comes with the tank then upgrade it to the redline later.

On the beesting website it says in the drop down box single QD (for daytona gun) so can't get that bit wrong lol.

I got a mate who's a diving instructor so hoping he can source me a 10 o 12L scuba tank. Guessing I'll also need a filling loop to fill the 1.5L tank from the Scuba?

Sorry for all the Q's I know absolutely nothing about hpa but enjoy learning! :P

Appreciate your help :)

 
The tank regulator is not the same as the in-line regulator: You need both. Redline SFR, Redline Firebase etc. are in-line regulators. The Ninja Pro V2, Guerrilla Myth G3 etc. are tank/bottle regulators.

The latter is to act as a 'plug' for the tank/bottle and to regulate the output pressure down from 4500psi (or 3000psi, if you have that kind of tank) to something the in-line regulator can use. It's also got the interface for filling (the 'fill nipple') and has 'burst disks' as a safety measure in case the pressure in the bottle gets too high - the disks crack and release the air inside at a safe rate if it's overfilled. The 'in-line' regulator -- or what people usually just call the 'regulator' (rather than the 'tank regulator' or 'bottle regulator') -- then steps the pressure down further to between 40-180psi (depends on the model of regulator, but this is adjustable so you can ensure the right amount gets to your gun). It also acts as the 'hub' for your lines and usually has its own emergency blow-off valve (similar to the burst disks mentioned before, but it doesn't have to be replaced if it's used). The in-line regulator uses something called a 'UFA' (Universal Fill Adapter) to attach to the top of the bottle regulator and allow the flow of air.

Pictures for both can be found here: http://www.airsoft-forums.co.uk/index.php/topic/30669-the-hpa-frequently-asked-questions-faq-wip/

Also, 'Redline' is just a brand, not a product :)

For the dive/scuba tank/cylinder, ensure it's 300bar. 232bar is the standard for most divers but this won't properly pressurise a 4500psi tank. 232bar = 3364psi; 300bar = 4351psi.

You need a fill station I mentioned on the list to get the air from the dive tank to your bottle. Something like this: http://www.beestingairsoft.com/product/hpa-direct-scuba-fill-station-300bar4500psi/ - whether it's DIN or Yoke depends on the dive tank you buy (and what valve it has). Your friend will be able to help, but usually with 300bar tanks it's DIN. Ensure your fill station is rated for 4500psi/300bar use.

 
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Oh, OK.

So where is the in line regulator positioned? The tank reg obviously fits on top of tank.

Damn, more expense! X)

 
Er, on top of the tank - it screws on via the UFA as described.

The top of the bottle is also a regulator, but I - and others - call it the 'bottle regulator' in an attempt to avoid confusion. Please look at the FAQ for pics as this is fully explained there. You will have a total of two regulators (if you include the top of the bottle). Basically: Buy that Dye 1.5L (come with a decent bottle regulator) and then buy a Redline SFR (and buy a bundle that comes with the line you want) from Beesting. Those are your regulators sorted, and both are the most highly recommended by DG users right now.

I really must say that if this is your first foray into HPA, the DG is not a brilliant choice. It is a bit rocky for newcomers because of the attention they need, so please make sure you put a good few hours into reading the FB page or you could do serious damage to it. The break-in in particular tends to need a lot of TLC. You may want to look into electric solenoid as those don't require the mechanical knowledge and will be up and running a lot smoother. Up to you of course as my DG was my first HPA, but I must've done 6 months of looking into it and I also was using exclusively GBBRs for years before, and the basic principles are the same.

Also, I was not kidding when I said "you can be looking at about £800 - £1000 to get one working in the UK."

 
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That's cool,

Well iv ordered the hardest bit from Canada, I'll prob get the tanks/regulators/line next month whilst researching it in-between. I enjoy the building/learning as much as the running around shooting! :P

 
Alrighty. Best of luck :)

 
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How much should I be looking to spend on a 300 bar 12L filling tank second hand Prof?

 
I paid £96 for mine (300 bar 10lt) but it was a steal. I'd say no more than £130 (in the best condition). I've seen silly prices on FB though so I'd avoid and stick to eBay - lots of dive shops put their old stuff on eBay in good condition when they want cleaner looking tanks.

Never buy a cylinder out of hydro. Even if it has one month left you at least still know it's going to be ok until you take it into the shop. Creation date doesn't matter too much on steel tanks so don't worry about buying one from the 80s or 90s.

Edit:

Best thing to do is to set up notification on eBay and nab a good one over the next couple of months. There's no rush to buy one immediately if you've got a dive shop nearby and a car and you could save a pile of cash. When you factor in fuel and the effort of taking it down to a shop to get it refilled though I'm not so sure.

 
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Great cheers prof,

I'll keep an eye out.

All I'm slowly amassing All the components required ;)

 
Yay!

My DG 249 kit arrived from Blackblitz yesterday! I'm amazed at how few parts to it there are. just one thing prof, when opening and inspecting the pin that locates the trigger contact just keeps falling straight through. Is this right? Just wondered because once it's running I'm guessing it'll be shaking about all over the place?

 
Yep. The sides of the M249 receiver hold it in.

You can put a tiny strip of selotape either sidde to stop it falling out when you fit/remove the kit.

 
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So here's what I have got so far for my DG 249:

A&K M249

DG kit

Ninja 90/4500 tank

Redline Airsoft SFR regulator

Amped QD line

Warrior Assault systems Cargo pack

Next lot of purchases will get me second tank, and scuba tank/filling loop.

View attachment 20558

 
That's a double QD line - you need a single QD. I.e. threaded into the regulator with only a single QD on the end that meets the gun.

Looks good other than that.

I don't think you'll fit a second tank in that Cargo Pack though. I just keep my second bottle in the safezone and switch to it in the middle of the day. Much lighter also.

If you switch to a single tank then change the SFR orientation so it sits down the side of the bottle reg as it reduces the overall height of the setup when it's in that pack. Consider using pneumatic sealant where the UFA meets the regulator as it doesn't let the threads to move but it's only tool strength so can be removed. In addition, use some kind of clip just to keep the zips closed when it's in there as it likely won't fully fit and obviously the line needs to fit out of the top of the bag. You don't want it unzipping mid game.

Also, buy a spare bucking if you don't already have one. I have some if you want one - you will probably break yours at some point and they're hard to get a hold of.

I would look into getting a spring or compression fitting for the line where it leaves the gun. The M249 can't use a DIGL (like a braided line that runs up the grip) as the bolt that the line passes through is too narrow. You can, however, use a spring and shrink wrap to add some durability and stop it from kinking when playing.

I don't know what you mean by 'filling loop', but if it's a whip then it's unnecessary. You simply need a fill station - nothing fancy: http://www.beestingairsoft.com/product/hpa-direct-scuba-fill-station-300bar4500psi/

That WAS Cargo Pack was an excellent choice by the way :)

 
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Ok,

So to make sure I got this right,

I need to change the line out from the regulator (and fitting into reg) from QD to a screw in single QD (see pic)

And now that iv actually got it all infront of me I nee to buy a fitting/connector for the end of the line that passes through the pistol grip?

And yes please, could I buy one of your spare buckings please prof.

View attachment 20559

View attachment 20560

 
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