Budget and Premium Motor Recommendations

[James Baker]

Hi Guys, 

I'm looking to upgrade the motors in 2 of my guns:

 My main gun -PTS masada. Which I'm happy to spend a fair amount on if the diffence is noticeable. Which pulls a M105 spring and 13:1 gears. Priority is efficiency and semi response. 

2nd gun is G36. This is just a back up gun but currently running SHS high speed motor which seems to draw alot of power as it and the electronics get rather warm. Priority is again efficiency. This runs M100 spring and 16:1 gears.

So any motor recommendations in these categories are welcome. 

Also if there are any motors that you just generally think are great please throw it in.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Iceni]

Don't bother with brands, and marked up motors.

I have several decent motors, the most expensive been the ASG ultimate cnc range, I actually have 2 of these, a 35K and a 30K. Between them the 35K performs like a high speed motor for 18:1 gears. The 30K performs more like a balanced motor with a lot of torque. Both give 24ish rps with 7.4v lipo's, The 30K is running 13:1 (M110 cut, SS 2 teeth, no AB) the 35K 18:1 (M90, Full stroke, Double shoots on fully charged 7.4v lipo, No AB).

Between the 2 setups the 13:1 30K is the better setup, It's far faster on the trigger. Doesn't need any AB, With the batteries I tend to use 7.4v 2200mAh 35/70C it runs for a full day on a single charge without any issues (I still swap at lunch).

However, any rare earth magnet 30K (16TPA) motor should give about the same performance. The ASG isn't any better than the others, It's probably worse because of the price. Coming in at £20 more expensive than the 16TPA SHS HT, and not doing anything more for the money.

If you run 11.1v batteries then 16TPA may be a little too fast without more modification. So you may need to look at a slower motor like a 22TPA, But I can't really go there as I've never seen a need for 11.1v when you can get 24 rps on 7.4v without doing a significant amount of modification.

 

 

[ak2m4]

If money is no barrier then one of the new Warhead brushless, fantastic motors.  On the budget end SHS high torque is pretty much the most popular, quite reliable.  Also the new fan-assisted XT motors seem to be performing well

 

[Adolf Hamster]

If money is no barrier then one of the new Warhead brushless, fantastic motors. 

i must confess to being curious about those, brushless was pretty well established in the rc world by the time i started airsoft but given in this hobby folk are still using nimh it doesn't surprise me it's taken this long for brushless to arrive.

 

[ak2m4]

@Adolf Hamster from my tests the bottom line seemed to be, lower power consumption, lower heat, better longevity, if the esc controller goes pop it can be replaced with a simple solder job.  No brushes so no carbon dust build up etc.

Here's some stats from a test I did with the Warhead Ultra vs a GP 14TPA

GP 14TPA Motor with 7.4v (fully charged)
RPS = 18
Full Auto Amp Draw = 25
Motor external temp after 2000 cycles = 50 (centigrade)

Warhead Ultra Motor with 7.4v (fully charged)
RPS = 27
Full Auto Amp Draw = 20
Motor external temp after 2000 cycles = 35 (centigrade)

The figures are pretty cool, the Warhead motor is 30% faster, draws 20% less amps and 30% cooler.  Although the motors aren't like for like it does give an idea.

 

[Alimcd]

Will you be retailing them?

 

[ak2m4]

Will you be retailing them?

No at the moment buddy

 

[Adolf Hamster]

@Adolf Hamster from my tests the bottom line seemed to be, lower power consumption, lower heat, better longevity, if the esc controller goes pop it can be replaced with a simple solder job.  No brushes so no carbon dust build up etc.

Here's some stats from a test I did with the Warhead Ultra vs a GP 14TPA

GP 14TPA Motor with 7.4v (fully charged)
RPS = 18
Full Auto Amp Draw = 25
Motor external temp after 2000 cycles = 50 (centigrade)

Warhead Ultra Motor with 7.4v (fully charged)
RPS = 27
Full Auto Amp Draw = 20
Motor external temp after 2000 cycles = 35 (centigrade)

The figures are pretty cool, the Warhead motor is 30% faster, draws 20% less amps and 30% cooler.  Although the motors aren't like for like it does give an idea.

yeah, the thing i'd probably be most concerned with is how well they work with AB, i know it's a motor killer generally but i'd be more worried about the electronics than the actual motor itself.

iirc the electric rc stuff uses motor braking although their control setup is a bit different (with the controller being pretty big compared to the warhead) and needless to say they aren't getting the same stop/start usage an airsoft gun would use.

 

[ak2m4]

yeah, the thing i'd probably be most concerned with is how well they work with AB, i know it's a motor killer generally but i'd be more worried about the electronics than the actual motor itself.

iirc the electric rc stuff uses motor braking although their control setup is a bit different (with the controller being pretty big compared to the warhead) and needless to say they aren't getting the same stop/start usage an airsoft gun would use.

yes that's a good point indeed.  hopefully this spring and summer they can get plenty of people out there using them in play.

 

[Adolf Hamster]

yes that's a good point indeed.  hopefully this spring and summer they can get plenty of people out there using them in play.

Yeah, i'm not a big expert on brushless, but from a mechanical sense it should be even more resilient. Electrically i'm guessing the controller will either ignore ab from the mosfet, or maybe take the signal and translate to its own braking.

I am kinda tempted, have a new build in the works. Might be a tad spicy for my original dsg plans though.

 

[Misery]

Yeah, i'm not a big expert on brushless, but from a mechanical sense it should be even more resilient. Electrically i'm guessing the controller will either ignore ab from the mosfet, or maybe take the signal and translate to its own braking.

I am kinda tempted, have a new build in the works. Might be a tad spicy for my original dsg plans though.

after seeing the punishment neg put this through i reckon it could work fine with ab im contemplating getting one for a build so i can test that out for ya XD having the speed controller to help regulate it will be a god send it should b in theory no diffrent from a brusless rc going down the road and u slamming the breaks on or trailing on the breaks when your bashing about

from bout 14 mins in

 

[Adolf Hamster]

after seeing the punishment neg put this through i reckon it could work fine with ab im contemplating getting one for a build so i can test that out for ya XD having the speed controller to help regulate it will be a god send it should b in theory no diffrent from a brusless rc going down the road and u slamming the breaks on or trailing on the breaks when your bashing about

from bout 14 mins in

yeah, it's a tricky one though i have a habit of mistrusting pre-production samples these days.

the rc thing is an interesting litmus test, never ran them back in the day (was always an internal combustion guy) but the performance even back then was undeniable.

like i say the main issue is nobody drives an rc the way we'd run airsoft guns, and i very much am in the semi-spam camp rather than using auto (just feels better having direct control on exactly how many rounds i'm sending downrange) so stop-start is the hell my guns have to put up with

 

[Misery]

i was same nitro all way with rc wasnt till i got into rc drifting i had brushless and boy your on off not like spamming a trigger but hard on off the throttle constantly on that and it would handle 50 min drift sessions no sweat,like i said i plan to get one in the next mth mth and half and like u prefer the control of semi so will give it a torture test as soon as i have it although will need another order into ak at same time for set of 18-1 gears lol dont fancy putting one in the 13-1 set up lol

 

[Adolf Hamster]

i probably would go for 13:1 because i'm insane.

or more correctly i spoiled myself with hpa mouse-button triggers and now i'm desperately trying to get an aeg to match up in response.

 

[Misery]

haha see im loving the response the hybrid mosfets given me versus the standard v2 with the limite time i had with it its incredbly noticeable,i have been looking more into hpa recently loool but thats a diffrent slippery slope ill come to another time lol

i may give it a go in the 13-1 but even with just a 16t rocket motor the thing is unreal

 

[James Baker]

Thanks again guys

 Coming in at £20 more expensive than the 16TPA SHS HT, and not doing anything more for the money.

 

Does the SHS HT use Neo magnets? Seemed to be so cheap i assumed it didn't!  -also are these the same as Rocket Motors?

@Adolf Hamster from my tests the bottom line seemed to be, lower power consumption, lower heat, better longevity, if the esc controller goes pop it can be replaced with a simple solder job.  No brushes so no carbon dust build up etc.

Here's some stats from a test I did with the Warhead Ultra vs a GP 14TPA

GP 14TPA Motor with 7.4v (fully charged)
RPS = 18
Full Auto Amp Draw = 25
Motor external temp after 2000 cycles = 50 (centigrade)

Warhead Ultra Motor with 7.4v (fully charged)
RPS = 27
Full Auto Amp Draw = 20
Motor external temp after 2000 cycles = 35 (centigrade)

The figures are pretty cool, the Warhead motor is 30% faster, draws 20% less amps and 30% cooler.  Although the motors aren't like for like it does give an idea.

This really makes me want a warhead motor! As mentioned by Iceni, when using a fast motor he gets double firing, I have had this too when using a high speed experiment build, I assume I would need to find a way to address that with this motor? 

Miserydrift I love negative airsoft's vids, only found him recently and can't stop binge watching them!

Thanks all for the replies, appreciate the time!

 

[Misery]

@James Baker i couldnt say about the magnets in the shs/rocket motors but having been using on for a week now have to say there decent motors and paired with 13-1 gears extremely quick

https://www.instagram.com/p/CMd9d4PHdeO/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

 

[Adolf Hamster]

haha see im loving the response the hybrid mosfets given me versus the standard v2 with the limite time i had with it its incredbly noticeable,i have been looking more into hpa recently loool but thats a diffrent slippery slope ill come to another time lol

i may give it a go in the 13-1 but even with just a 16t rocket motor the thing is unreal

hpa is a tricky beast.

you put the effort in to set them up right they can give top end performance for the fundamental task of slinging plastic downrange, perfect trigger response and do it super-quiet or super-loud depending on your tastes.

however whilst the air line isn't as awkward as most anti-hpa guys make it out to be, the ancillary stuff is a bit of a faff especially if you have to work around sites that don't have filling facilities.

i think what killed it for me was all that expense and effort to get the perfect shot could be countered with zero cost and effort by the target simply ignoring the hits (or shouting friendly fire when you sneak up behind them).

 

[Misery]

oh i could imagine bud

but tbh its the same with an aeg you can go to all manner of cost setting it up upgrading getting it slinging those bbs the best only to have the same happen

but again thats a whole diff argument and at min hpa is just a thought for me not something im taken seriousley yet lol love my aeg to much the sound the hassle hahaha and if im throwing 100+ a motor i sure as hell aint changing to hpa anytime soon XD maybe in a year or so lol