Found it
Sorry I've been looking for an article I read a year or so ago, I thought it was on redit but I was wrong so it's taken me a little longer to find the source!
Sorry for linking to another forum, but in this article a guy actually strips both the 2600mAh titan and a 3000mAh titan.
https://www.airsoftsociety.com/threads/objective-battery-test-titan-lion-vs-kypom-lipo-vs-hv-lipo.161379/
It's quite an interesting article TBF and the guy doing the test seems fairly legit. That however is irrelevant as it shows that at the particular time for those batteries it was indeed Sony VTC6's been used. I needed to find that article before I continued as I needed that cell proof.
As a VTC6 it's an unprotected Li-ion. Meaning it has no internal fusing to prevent an over amp situation. Manufacturer recommendations for that cell are that is should have a protected circuit or a battery management circuit for safe operation. And in addition a battery management circuit should also have an 80c cut off. So if the battery is getting to that temp the circuit protects the battery and the user. We don't use either in Airsoft.
You do see this done correctly in power tool batteries. Where running your tool hard will make the battery cut out, and it also will refuse to charge in that situation. Yes they are over amping the batteries, but they do it in a safe way.
The Max burst amps is 30A, the max continuous is 15A meaning it's a 5C/10C cell.
There are other issues, These packs are wrapped, and Titan make no claims about the cell origin, I had suspected it was VTC6 but it could have also been a Sanyo or molicel as I couldn't recall exactly what the article I'd read was pointing at. Trouble there is if supply of VTC6 becomes harder then swapping to another battery with similar specs would be possible and nobody would know. Supply of some batteries has dried up anyone that vapes will have seen this.
The original poster of that article goes further. He has a thread on another forum with more Li-ions been tested. Again it's an interesting read.
https://www.digitalcomplex.org/index.php?showtopic=2289&pid=33996&st=0&#entry33996
So what you can take away from that is in order to run a titan on say a mildly upgraded gun, you will be over the recommendations set by Sony. And you will be doing it without protection. So you have absolutely no idea how hot those cells are getting or how much drain you are applying. A standard fuse will protect you for a sustained high amp draw, but not for one that is spiking the fuse quickly, or if you say run a 25A fuse that whilst it's safe for the motor, isn't quite as safe for the battery, Since you could be drawing a sustained 24A draw not blow the fuse but cook the battery.
In addition to that titan themselves have stated that overdrawing the batteries will cause degradation to the cells and significantly reduce the cycles expected.
https://www.titanpower.eu/pages/faq#
How many cycles can I expect from these batteries?
Lifetime depends on use style, the below are guidelines and should result in about 70% to 80% of it's original capacity:
500+ cycles - light use: low discharge rates (<1C), keeping the pack between 10% and 90% charged, proper pack storage when not in use (about 30% SOC).
300 cycles - standard use: above maximum discharge rates, ending the pack's use at 10% (about 2.9v), proper pack storage when not in use (about 30% SOC).
100 cycles - hard use: consistent use at maximum discharge rates, going to minimum voltage during use, stored at full or empty capacity, etc.
<100 cycles - excessive use: consistent use beyond maximum discharge rates, going to minimum voltage during use, stored at full or empty capacity, etc.
It's just not possible to recommend something that is so flawed. Yes yours might be working perfectly and not be having any issues. But that doesn't mean everyone will be so lucky.
@Lozart You can actually see in the graphs produced in that article the issue I'm trying to highlight.
There are 2 graphs with 25A discharge curves. Now the discharge is pretty good and as expected - you get slightly less capacity at a higher discharge rate, and some voltage drop. The issue however is the second part of those graphs showing the temp rise against consumed Ah.
In a protected battery circuit you should see a cut off at the 1.1Ah mark where the cell hits 80c. That curve is potentially steeper for us as we have more Amp draw to get our motors and gearboxes moving in the first place and will be drawing more amps. The trouble is we have no idea where that point of been safe is, and every gun is different - Wildly different.
If the technology was say able to output 10/20C then the Li-ion would be the perfect battery. As at 3Ah it would be 30/60A and there is a very good chance that our standard discharge curves would be closer to the 15A discharge on the graphs where the 80c limit is never reached for the full discharge of the cell.
And in addition to that if we had more space for batteries li-ion could already be the perfect battery, The molicel 21700 for example can do 45A continuous. It's just the space we can't afford, but that technology will improve eventually.
https://www.imrbatteries.com/content/molicel_p42a.pdf
One final point about higher C ratings on Li-po's. Have a look at Lozarts chart again. If you run a high C Li-po then that voltage drop you see when more amps are used is less apparent. This means your gun shoots at a higher ROF for longer, and the Battery stays cooler for longer. It's a win win if you have the space to accommodate such a unit.
I found another guy who likes messing with batteries. He tried to do bad things to a Li-Ion cell.
