Utility of gas rifles on the field

[Mantle]

Leaning more and more towards a gas powered rifle as they look to be a lot of fun! I would like to get the opinions of a couple of gas users before I do though.

Of course, they have much lower capacity magazines than your average electric gun, do they actually have a fair chance in most firefights?

I would assume picking your shots and conserving ammo is now of greater priority and I have heard about cooldown issues, so does that basically rule out full auto and mean you always stick to semi? If not, how often is full auto used?

Upon initial inspection, it seems most gas rifles roughly share the ammo capacity of their real counterparts - What's the usual recommended amount of mags to have when owning a gas rifle? I understand there are many variables at play here such as play style, game length, etc...

I suppose my last question to you gas users is, do you recommend using a gas rifle as a primary when the majority have electric?

Cheers fellas!

 

[EvilMonkee]

I recently repurchased a GHK AKM.  I run 3 mags, I could use a couple more but don't ever feel like I am outgunned.  Then again, I only go to themed historical airsoft games and not normal skirmishes.  GHK are superb in terms of gas efficiency.  Its great fun to shoot and I get great range out of it completely stock (80m measured Google Maps).  Mine runs at 360 on a .2 and I use .36s in it.  I love it, love using it but you must remember the context of my not attending normal games.  Got some outrageous kills this weekend with it, and the .36 certainly help people notice they have been hit.  I only use semi.  

 

[AK47frizzle]

Gas rifles are for people who:

• want realism
  
• hate dealing with electronics (charging batteries etc)
  

Gas rifles have quite a few lot of cons though:

• more expensive in the long run
  
• much heavier
  
• gas cooldown issues
  
• less ammo capacity
  
• less accurate in auto
  
• don't work well in the cold in general
  

AEGs will simply outgun most GBBRs on the field: larger ammo capacity, more consistent, and much lighter to carry. I've found that a larger ammo capacity is a winner for me in AEGs. BBs are decently accurate, but they're not THAT accurate since even the heaviest of ammo can be swayed by the wind. Having as many follow up shots as you need to is a huge benefit to AEGs that GBBRs don't have. 

You mainly get GBBRs for the cool factor. And yes, I own one currently and they are VERY COOL. However, I know damn well that I wouldn't want to use one on the field. They're just not for someone like me who ignores realism and goes in fast and hard.

 

[EDcase]

I've not tried a gbbr but for a general skirmish I think you would be frustrated by limited ammo.

I also mainly use single shot but having several hi-cap magazines and no cool down in full auto means you'll always run out of ammo in a firefight.  To have any chance you'd have to stay at the back and pick enemies off a bit like a sniper.

 

[DrAlexanderTobacco]

Words

There are a lot of variables to each site which can change what I'm about to say, so keep that in mind.

I think for one to remain competitive prima facie against an AEG you will need to become comfortable with reloading often, in the field, to maintain the fire superiority you would normally enjoy with an AEG - i.e. the ability to unleash 200 rounds per engagement if the situation calls for it, owing to suppression/covering your mates/etc. The key difference ultimately between GBBR and AEG (ignoring joule creep) is mag capacity imo and I see a lot of people (including myself!) either trying to be picky with shots taken, which can lead to a drop in aggressiveness, the ability to cover your team, having to drop your guard to reload more often...

Of course, there are variables that come into play. You might play at a site where games are fast and frequent, meaning you'll be caught short fewer times and can do your reloading outside of the game. You might prefer sneaking/picking your targets, which diminishes the amount of times you'll need to spam the trigger if you're good at it. CQB will mean you might enjoy a greater level of autonomy because your buddies might be closer, engagements are shorter etc.

The one thing I really enjoy about GBB(r)s is being certain of that instant trigger response, it's a nice comfort in CQB. I used to use a TM MP7 and did pretty well with it. I sucked hard in open ground owing to mag capacity etc.

If I go back to GBBR I've been toying with the idea of making a ready-bag, MBSS or similar, full of quick-access stuff I can reload with. BB bags, gas, speedloader etc - and basically get used to going "all out" in every single engagement with the acceptance I'll be reloading/topping up immediately after.

 

[BigStew]

They are fun, but they are significantly more expensive to get set up like 100s more, they are more expensive to run, they require far more maintenance, they have limited usability due to temperature, in an stand up fight you will be utterly out gunned by an aeg. But they are fun and really good in indoor cqb.

 

[EvilMonkee]

• much heavier
  

Not true at least in the case of my GHK AK.  The rifle itself is a lot lighter than my equivalent LCT AKM and its a good comparison since LCT make the externals for GHK.  Where they are heavier is in the magazines.

 

[Dentonboy]

The main thing with going GBBR only for me are the following:

- you want consistency and decent performance, so TM is an almost essential route to go down when buying.

- you will need a fair few magazines. These are heavy and pricey.

- you pick your shots/battles/engagements with much more care.

- you often need to get your shots off first and make them count!

- it is fun AF to go gas but you will feel outgunned when your single shot is met by twenty in return.

- temperature plays a huge part in the effectiveness of your gun but TM's generally run well all year round down south.

 

[bladerunner168]

Gas rifles have quite a few lot of cons though:

• much heavier
  

Much heavier? Not true at all.

A TM Recoil CQBR is around 3.4KG with mag and battery is 

The equivalent GHK model with fully gassed mag is  around 3.1KG

There's relatively little material inside of a GBBR.

There's a gearbox inside an AEG,

 

[AK47frizzle]

Not true at least in the case of my GHK AK.  The rifle itself is a lot lighter than my equivalent LCT AKM and its a good comparison since LCT make the externals for GHK.  Where they are heavier is in the magazines.

Yes, as a whole, they are generally much heavier because of the mags. 1 AEG mag is around 100-200 grams. 1 GBB mag is around 300-500g. And not to mention AEG mags carry anywhere from 3 to 15 times the capacity of GBB mag. And you would normally carry more GBB mags than AEG mags too.

 

[EvilMonkee]

Yes, but there is nothing inside the receivers in comparison.

As I tend to outrange most people I don't find that only having 40rd mags is that much of an issue.

 

[Wo1f]

Depends entirely on your play style. I’ve never at any point felt outgunned using my gas guns. Generally speaking, I use semi auto only regardless of using a gbbr or a Tm recoil. My m4 gbbr will happily full auto mag dump and retain all of its accuracy (which is usually better than any AEG I’ve come across anyway). 

A well setup gbbr can dominate in cqb or woodland. I run a TM MP7 gbbr at level 2 and a TM mws DMR for woodland. As long as you play to the strengths and weaknesses of what you’re running and you can handle the mag capacity, gbbr’s are the best thing out there as far as I’m concerned. The only disadvantage to a gbbr that I thin

A general point about being outgunned is the same as the whole rate of fire issue. Imagine you have 2 guns. One is a gbbr with a 35 round mag and one is an aeg with a 150rd mid cap. Both shoot just as far and just as accurately. You aim both at an enemy player 50m away and they both hit with a single shot. What is the point or advantage in the extra mag capacity? You either miss with more BB’s so you’ve wasted half a mag or you’ve hit them with half a mag and on that basis you’re a tw@t. A hit is a hit and a miss is a miss regardless of firing a single shot or a burst some gimpy 300rps speedsofter gun. 

 

[AK47frizzle]

Much heavier? Not true at all.

A TM Recoil CQBR is around 3.4KG with mag and battery is 

The equivalent GHK model with fully gassed mag is  around 3.1KG

There's relatively little material inside of a GBBR.

There's a gearbox inside an AEG,

A TM recoil is a very specific example and isn't representative of your average aeg. A gearbox itself isn't heavy at all. My personal custom built AEG only weighs in at around 2.5kg with a mag. TM recoils have a lot more bells and whistles than your average AEG that add to the weight. 

I have a WE GBB M4 atm. It weighs in at 2.7kg with no mag or attachments. My AEG is around 2.4kg with no mag or attachments. Both are full metal. Here are some stats which I took just:

Empty WE:

View attachment 47379

Empty AEG:

View attachment 47380

Empty KC02

View attachment 47381

No picture, but an empty stanag AEG metal mag is 192g with a 300 rnd capacity.

You can see that weight will quickly stack up with GBB guns and mags. There's no denying it. Jesus christ KC02 mags are 500g each with 30rd capcity. You should also consider that your average AEG user will likely have a plastic body gun too, weighing at less than 2kg. With the exception of the GHK G5, I don't think a GBBR will come close to achieving those kinds of weights.

 

[Wo1f]

Why do you need it to be super light anyway? If you’re that weak that an extra 1-2kg is a game changer then that also rules out 85% of all other AEG’s too. Any lmg, any DMR or long.. 

if you havent extensively used a gbbr and AEG, then please don’t chime in with your opinion on this thread (Aimed at nobody in particular)

 

[Yukarin]

My solution to temperature issues is to tape a handwarmer to the mag, I can run propane / green gas even around 0 degrees beause of this "mod". If you dont like the look of a handwarmer on your magazine, putting it inside your mag pouch may suffice.

 

[Wo1f]

My solution to temperature issues is to tape a handwarmer to the mag, I can run propane / green gas even around 0 degrees beause of this "mod". If you dont like the look of a handwarmer on your magazine, putting it inside your mag pouch may suffice.

Done this before to good effect. Can also alter the gas. I tend to use propane until it’s getting to freezing temps then switch to Guarder power up gas or MAP gas

 

[bladerunner168]

A TM recoil is a very specific example and isn't representative of your average aeg. A gearbox itself isn't heavy at all. My personal custom built AEG only weighs in at around 2.5kg with a mag. TM recoils have a lot more bells and whistles than your average AEG that add to the weight. 

A TM recoil is actually representative as they both posses the same realistic functions. You have a custom built, of course that's going to be lighter, I'm talking straight OOTB comparisons.

You should also consider that your average AEG user will likely have a plastic body gun too, weighing at less than 2kg. 

That's simply not true, why would you say that?

Just observing the RIF's used during a normal skirmish event, metal AEG's are quite paramount.

 

[Tiercel]

Had a WE G36, used it ocasionally at regular skirmish days. It was hella fun to use, but I was massively outgunned all day long. It would be ideal at milsim days, or even days where they regulate ammo count. But on a normal skirmish when everyone and their mum has 10 hicaps on them and youve got 5 lowcaps its a bit one sided. I have a TM MP7 now which at 50 round mags is slightly more useable for regular skirmishes, slap some .28s in it and its got phenomenal range, and it dominates at CQB but I probably wouldnt run it as a main woodland gun unless Im just in the mood for pissing about with it because its so much more fun to use than an AEG.

GBBR Pros:

- so much fun to use

GBBR Cons:

-literally everything else

 

[AK47frizzle]

A TM recoil is actually representative as they both posses the same realistic functions. You have a custom built, of course that's going to be lighter, I'm talking straight OOTB comparisons.





That's simply not true, why would you say that?

Just observing the RIF's used during a normal skirmish event, metal AEG's are quite paramount.

No, they are not representative. Why do you insist on trying to use a specialized product as an example, compared to a generic AEG with basic functions? We are trying to compare your average GBBR to your average AEG. Not realistic gun vs half realistic gun. TM recoils are not your average AEG because they are a lot more expensive, have a recoil system, bolt lock, proprietary mags and gearbox, and other unique stuff that I may not know, which are supposed to simulate a realistic function in electric form. Your average AEG does NOT have these proprietary functions.

An average AEG is a thing that some bloke would buy that doesn't break the bank, and consists of: body, generic gearbox, and generic hop unit. Average AEGs are meant to just fire the BB with no extra realistic simulation attached. I used my custom AEG as an example because it contains the basic functions and no more, like your average AEG.

This is quite literally the definition of your average AEG: https://www.patrolbase.co.uk/g-and-g-armament-combat-machine-cm16-raider

Why would it be unlikely that the average user would have a plastic body when these were and probably still are the number 1 recommended AEG for... everybody? Kids use it. Adults use it. This thing weighs 2kg and people love it. Your average GBBR is 3kg+. Stack the mags and you get something that's significantly heavier than some kid with a CM16 would be zipping around the field with.

Specna Arms rifles are also quite rampant these days. What about the ARP craze? Even the dreaded Nuprol AEGs are a common sight. These AEGs I have mentioned are common items that people buy when they want a new gun to work well and doesn't break the bank.

All i'm trying to say is: TM recoils are not something any casual/new player would buy. They are niche products for people who want a simulated realistic function in their guns because the average AEG isn't supposed to perform like real steel guns. OP is trying to compare the usefulness of gas rifles to average AEG rifles. I brought up the notion that the weight of your average AEG rifle is much less than the average GBBR. And your average AEG is sadly not a TM recoil. If it were true, then everybody saying that AEGs are generally much cheaper, are wrong... are they?

 

[Wo1f]

The plastic bodied AEG’s are popular because they’re cheap and that’s the only reason. Nothing to do with weight otherwise we’d all be running around with carbon fiber AEG’s. All the nuprol/ combat machine stuff is cheap. It gets them into the sport at a low cost. 

All the specna arms stuff ive seen have been metal 416’s and I don’t associate with Lycra wearing ARP9 users because it seems being an irritating bellend is contagious. 

End of the day running a GBBR isn’t like carrying a boulder. If you can’t aim for shit and you’ve got the arm strength of a 7 year old it’s not for you. It doesn’t disadvantage a regular human