Opinions/help on a sniping setup

[Taiga]

Alright, so I'm "reasonably" new to airsoft, not some much as the casual player but I'm not what I would call well equipment. 

I'm mainly looking for some advice on buying guns, brands, types (elec, gas, spring) and most important buying.

First I'll start of with the current guns which I have in mind and the brand which I'm leaning towards.

So, after a few months worth of skirmishing I eventually applied for a UKARA and I'm now looking to get my own guns instead of renting. The place where I skirmish has a plethora of rent-able guns, and of course most people will let you have a few rounds on there own. For the most part I enjoyed snipers the most, mainly spring. I've tested both spring and gas snipers and found that, at-least in my case, spring is far more consistent in accuracy, power and range. I eventually decided that I wanted to get myself a spring sniper so I asked for some recommendations from the lads at my site and the majority of them recommend the VSR-10, particularly the TM. (There all crazy about tokyo marui and stand by build quality and performance. While I'm not partially educated on this area, it is safe to say that yes, usually most things produced in Japan will be of a higher quality of that then somewhere like china. But the price tag follows). I've also heard a lot of people talking about the bar-10, being a really got rifle to upgrade. I genially just want something which I can reminisce with every now and again, it doesn't have to be the best accuracy or speed, It just needs to last a hell of a long time!

I was also looking to get a sidearm, partially a pistol. My main focus was on AEP pistols, I've heard a few stories about gas pistols going dead when the airs nippy. I know different types of gas are designed for different types of pistol so obvious that plays a huge part. In all honesty, I just need a pistol for close range combat which will be reliable and work whenever. While I know there is a stock pile of reasons to go with gas I don't see the appeal myself. The pistol which I have been looking at on fire-support is the Glock G-18C (Tokyo Marui - since it's the only glock they offer). from here I'm in another situation where I don't know if quality justifies price.  To buy the glock itself from fire support it would cost around £165 for (the glock, a battery, a charger and an extra mag), While a CYMA G18C AEP glock would cost around £70 and include charger, battery and magazine.

I'm on the fence about many of these opinions which I have stated above, I do really like TM guns (since I've tested a fair few) but I don't know if the price-tag is justified since I haven't tested many CYMA or other brands. Lastly, is it worth looking into picking up a pre-upgraded sniper?

I know there's a lot to answer here and it's kind of a broad statement, hope I can get some views and opinions.

Thanks
Shi -

 

[padraigthesniper]

TM VSR 10's are really good but they are a bit dull and boring. To get the most out of them you need to spend a good deal of money. If i was just starting as a sniper i would personally get a well l96 as the bolt always felt more fun to me. The sound of a vsr is not as soft and nice unless you get some tech with know how to dampen it. You could get a Well L96 that shoots 460 fps out the box and just add a high end inner barrel and hop up and play for a few games with that till you can upgrade the trigger,spring and piston and bolt down the line. Or you could look at the SilverBack SRS the gun has good out of the box performance and can be upgraded too. Or if you dont want to upgrade your gun and you have a lot of money and time to spend you could get a noveritsch ssg which is essentially a fully upgraded variant of the vsr series. 

As for side arms the TM AEPs will last longer and perform slightly better. You could always do what i use to do and run around with a Vsr 10 and a AUG Para on my back for backup lol. The cyma AEP will do the job but if your gonna be using it alot might as well get the TM. 

 

[Prisce]

Ok, snipers, what a can of worms to open. Lots of things to consider here. 

Budget! 

Is it going to skirmished regularly, or be a wall ornament?

What style of Sniper? Bullpup? VSR? M24? The ergonomics are different for each.

Site limits?

You say you don’t mind spring/AEG/Gas, there is a BIG difference in the three, are you sure?

Are you proficient at teching? Or are you a complete novice in the area?

Pistols. 

This is different.

Are you going for silent and stealthy with the sniper, or do you just want a very good pistol?

Or perhaps a small SMG?

Budget?

Pre-upgraded snipers.

Depends who’s done the work! 

Swapped a “fully upgraded” TM VSR for my DMR, trusted the bloke, turns out the internals were mashed together. Cylinder was bollocksed, glide rings were smashed, piston was bent, hop unit cracked. Still in the process of getting it firing right.

If you can answer those questions, I will give you a slection or honest and ideal choices for you when I get in from work.

 

[Taiga]

Ok, snipers, what a can of worms to open. Lots of things to consider here. 

Budget! 

Is it going to skirmished regularly, or be a wall ornament?

What style of Sniper? Bullpup? VSR? M24? The ergonomics are different for each.

Site limits?

You say you don’t mind spring/AEG/Gas, there is a BIG difference in the three, are you sure?

Are you proficient at teching? Or are you a complete novice in the area?

Pistols. 

This is different.

Are you going for silent and stealthy with the sniper, or do you just want a very good pistol?

Or perhaps a small SMG?

Budget?

Pre-upgraded snipers.

Depends who’s done the work! 

Swapped a “fully upgraded” TM VSR for my DMR, trusted the bloke, turns out the internals were mashed together. Cylinder was bollocksed, glide rings were smashed, piston was bent, hop unit cracked. Still in the process of getting it firing right.

If you can answer those questions, I will give you a slection or honest and ideal choices for you when I get in from work.

regarding budget - I'm a uni student so there's definitely not an infinite well
Skirmish times - Once every 2 weeks
Style - looking for something light, I want to play reasonably aggressive rather then being the guy who waits everything out. VSR is appealing to me.

Site limit - 500fps - over 25m away - also BOLT's only
Type - Spring for sniper, AEP for pistols
Teching - no real experience but I've reasonably handy
Pistol - as stated, aggressive play style, so a good pistol which will last
Thanks!

 

[Rogerborg]

the TM AEPs will last longer and perform slightly better [than the CYMAs]

How much longer did your TM AEP last compared to your CYMA?  What was the difference in performance?

The CYMA is a 1:1 clone, and reportedly (I can't confirm or deny) has a more robust gearbox shell, which matters if you're going to upgrade the spring.

£46.52 + postage for a CYMA: http://www.taiwangun.com/en/electric-2/sortrice/direction:asc

£10 + postage for an Eagle6 spring https://eagle6.co.uk/shop/catalog/product/view/id/206/s/eagle6-airsoft-upgrade-spring-for-aep-cmg-series/

I put in the Laylax bearings as well as the stock nylon ones are a bit sloppy, but it's not really necessary.

Wire in a JST connector and run 300mAh 7.4V lipos https://hobbyking.com/en_us/turnigy-nano-tech-300mah-2s-35-70c-lipo-pack.html?___store=en_us

260+fps, 10rps+, giggles abound.  The AEPs are significantly bulkier than gas guns though.  Personally I'm running the CM.123 "1911" which was an accidentally lucky buy as it takes the AEP Glock mags, including the extended ones, but has more battery space under the barrel.

On the sniper, why buy a TM then replace all of the internals?  I went for a Well MB-03, currently £57.28 from TG: http://www.taiwangun.com/en/spring/mb03-wooden-well-tgg?from=listing

It's already got a steel trigger and sear.  Add £20 for a "tune up" kit with a spring, piston and piston guide and that's you up to or beyond 500fps (mine shot at 600 fps until I clipped the spring down).  After that you're on the quest to find the perfect hop chamber, rubber and barrel, which you'll be doing with any sniper anyway.

What I actually wanted was the MB-02 shorty sniper, but I couldn't find one in stock at the time at the price that I wanted to pay.  I'm still pondering trying to bag one and swapping the bits over.

Budget solutions can perform fairly well, with a bit of work.

 

[Taiga]

How much longer did your TM AEP last compared to your CYMA?  What was the difference in performance?

The CYMA is a 1:1 clone, and reportedly (I can't confirm or deny) has a more robust gearbox shell, which matters if you're going to upgrade the spring.

£46.52 + postage for a CYMA: http://www.taiwangun.com/en/electric-2/sortrice/direction:asc

£10 + postage for an Eagle6 spring https://eagle6.co.uk/shop/catalog/product/view/id/206/s/eagle6-airsoft-upgrade-spring-for-aep-cmg-series/

I put in the Laylax bearings as well as the stock nylon ones are a bit sloppy, but it's not really necessary.

Wire in a JST connector and run 300mAh 7.4V lipos https://hobbyking.com/en_us/turnigy-nano-tech-300mah-2s-35-70c-lipo-pack.html?___store=en_us

260+fps, 10rps+, giggles abound.  The AEPs are significantly bulkier than gas guns though.  Personally I'm running the CM.123 "1911" which was an accidentally lucky buy as it takes the AEP Glock mags, including the extended ones, but has more battery space under the barrel.

On the sniper, why buy a TM then replace all of the internals?  I went for a Well MB-03, currently £57.28 from TG: http://www.taiwangun.com/en/spring/mb03-wooden-well-tgg?from=listing

It's already got a steel trigger and sear.  Add £20 for a "tune up" kit with a spring, piston and piston guide and that's you up to or beyond 500fps (mine shot at 600 fps until I clipped the spring down).  After that you're on the quest to find the perfect hop chamber, rubber and barrel, which you'll be doing with any sniper anyway.

What I actually wanted was the MB-02 shorty sniper, but I couldn't find one in stock at the time at the price that I wanted to pay.  I'm still pondering trying to bag one and swapping the bits over.

Budget solutions can perform fairly well, with a bit of work.

As stated in another reply, while I can do some tech work, I am also a uni student. My time is very limited and very valuable as is. Pretty much the only days I get off are Sundays which just so happens to be my skirmishing days. 

Overall I'm just looking for something cheap, which is decent with little work. That's the main reason the VSR-10 appeals to me. While I've never tried a completely stock one, a few guys at my skirmishing site has lightly modified VSR-10 which felt fine. To me at-least. (As I said, not an expert, I know how most guns work and function, internals is reasonably simple to wrap my head around, I'm just looking for performance over cash over time.

 

[Druid799]

Style - looking for something light, I want to play reasonably aggressive rather then being the guy who waits everything out. VSR is appealing to me.

Site limit - 500fps - over 25m away - also BOLT's only
Type - Spring for sniper, AEP for pistols
Teching - no real experience but I've reasonably handy
Pistol - as stated, aggressive play style, so a good pistol which will last
Thanks!

To be honest mate with this description of how you want to play , your going to be just another CoD wanna be sniper who’ll be going absolutely no where fast at a scurmish . We see this kind of player game after game , there usually fairly new to the game , there running around the site shooting away and most of the time hitting jack shit to boot ! 

Only time you ever see a player hit there target with a sniper and on the fly I’m pretty sure they’ll have been playing a good few yrs and there gun is ‘tweeked’ to perfection .

you want to be a sniper ? Crack on but your going to need to learn how too first , and that’s find cover , stop fidgeting , keep quiet , select your targets VERY carefully and stay put ! ?

 

[Taiga]

To be honest mate with this description of how you want to play , your going to be just another CoD wanna be sniper who’ll be going absolutely no where fast at a scurmish . We see this kind of player game after game , there usually fairly new to the game , there running around the site shooting away and most of the time hitting jack shit to boot ! 

Only time you ever see a player hit there target with a sniper and on the fly I’m pretty sure they’ll have been playing a good few yrs and there gun is ‘tweeked’ to perfection .

you want to be a sniper ? Crack on but your going to need to learn how too first , and that’s find cover , stop fidgeting , keep quiet , select your targets VERY carefully and stay put ! ?

My intention wasn't to give a run and gun aura, I know a lot about the CoD wannabes who think there can bring there stats from a controller on the field.

Let me add a bit more information surround my site and how we usually operate. essentially, nearly every two weeks, we play in a 100+ ache woodland and the usually is attack and defend. We start from one site, push and clear, and set a time. They then do the same, which ever team gets the better time wins. What I mean by my play style is for the most part of the game, I want to snipe. sit further back then most my team and essentially support. then when we need to move in, and bare in mind it's a heavy woodland, I want a good pistol to push with. On defending the way I play is literally hold a single angel until shit goes down, now, when using a sniper. Once the enemy has pushed they have to clear, as extra players alive a time penalties. This is also where a good reliable pistol is going to be used often.

The best way I could describe it, I don't want to be the sniper who just sits there, in a full guille for the whole game, while I find it quite interesting I lose a large part of the enjoyment aspect. However I don't want to be the guy running around, thinking he can dodge everything, "quick scope" people and move onto the next. My main role I'm looking for is to be with and support my team by providing the extra range and accuracy.

(Also I prefer Rainbow 6 and CSGO, more of a PC player )

 

[Prisce]

regarding budget - I'm a uni student so there's definitely not an infinite well
Skirmish times - Once every 2 weeks
Style - looking for something light, I want to play reasonably aggressive rather then being the guy who waits everything out. VSR is appealing to me.

Site limit - 500fps - over 25m away - also BOLT's only
Type - Spring for sniper, AEP for pistols
Teching - no real experience but I've reasonably handy
Pistol - as stated, aggressive play style, so a good pistol which will last
Thanks!

After reading and understanding all of this I don’t think my opinion is going to help you.

While a TM VSR is a good gun, it will still require you to spend at least another £150(probably more) to get it to a standard where you can actually compete. A well tuned AEG can outrange a stock VSR. With ease.

To get a decent sniper your looking minimum £300, nearer £500 for the complete set up.

The SRS silverback is the best out of the box sniper to date. You can look that up and see the price involved.

Pistol wise, any gas TM will do you proud. The Hk45 or hicappa will probably suit your play style.

If I was in your shoes, I’d get a decent AEG, R hopped and use it similarly to a sniper at 350fps(so you can auto if necessary), and get an ASG MK23 and upgrade it(can all be done for under £90-incl gun purchase). A little handheld sniper for the sneaky long range shots, and a lot of oomph with the AEG...

Once your finances are in better shape you can consider getting a bolty!

 

[Rogerborg]

then when we need to move in, and bare in mind it's a heavy woodland, I want a good pistol to push with

You'll want an effective secondary, which isn't necessarily a pistol.  I'd direct your eyes towards my groin, where you'll find a strap on.  An MP5K strapped onto a leg panel, that is.  A surprising ~320 fps, full auto, cheap 90 round mid caps, and all for £73.03 from TG: http://www.taiwangun.com/en/electric-3/g-5k-galx

Not the best quality gun in the world, and you'll want to secure the hop adjustment arm in place, but it's usable out of the box, gets better with 7.4V lipos, and can serve as a primary in a pinch.

You could also consider a light carbine - the CYMA M4s are cheap and cheerful.

I do like pistol play in CQB, but since you're considering electric, I feel compelled to point out that if you go a little larger, you can get a lot more performance for not much extra money (and for less than any GBB pistol that you'd want to use [although see @Prisce's point about the Mk 23 NBB]).

 

[Arwen]

I'd second what @Prisce has said about getting a 350fps AEG instead. To upgrade most modern AEGs for range and accuracy a hop unit and hop rubber+nub is pretty much all you really need. All it would be around £60 tops - a perfectly good set up for around £40 is more than do-able. 
For example, my G&G, absolutely standard shoots out to 50m with no drop in accuracy. A lot of stock snipers seem to even struggle with that. 

My Recce, after borrowing the hop unit from my G&G and spending £25 on a new hop rubber and flat nub it is now shooting 70m+. Both of these shoot 345fps on .2 bbs. 

Another little note... you say your playing style is "aggressive". Personally, I don't think an aggressive playing style and sniping goes hand in hand. I would be concerned that in the heat of the game, you would loose track of your MED and simply shoot anyone who got close. At best you will get a telling off from the marshals. At worse you could do someone serious injury.  

 

[Careless]

not sure if this has been mentioned but {my opinion anyway} sniping in airsoft is a play style/state of mind , you dont need a bolt action sniper to do it ....

when i have sniped with a bolty , i did have fun but i have more fun with an auto gun thats setup to 350fps and used like a sniper , aimed accurate fire , only shoot when you can hit them ...  do decent work on the hop up and barrel and your have zero minimum engagement distance to worry about anyway so when your sneaking through and come across a guy or 2  right infront of you ,you have no worrys , just shoot!

 

[padraigthesniper]

How much longer did your TM AEP last compared to your CYMA?  What was the difference in performance?

I personally have only used the cyma for one game day but the TM i saw at a game from another player in respawn and the bb's seemed more consistent. Ive owned multiple TM AEGS and they have always been of higher quality than cyma. TM is going to be of higher quality whether it matters is up to the person paying. I wouldn't even get a aep i'd get a MP5K Aeg cheap chinese make that shoots 300 fps and can be slung on your side. The asg mk23 Gas pistol is also really good sniper side arm.

 

[clumpyedge]

not sure if this has been mentioned but {my opinion anyway} sniping in airsoft is a play style/state of mind , you dont need a bolt action sniper to do it ....

100% this... Ive seen people outplay a whole team just by taking on what I guess some would call the "sniper ethos"

If you want to go full sniper, go for it... but I can highly suspect you'll be in the classifieds section in 6 months, Most people don't even bother venturing into the sniping world until they've had a fair bit more experience (especially learning to upgrade your own stuff) your wallet will thank you in the long run if you do a hell of a lot more research into what you want and how you want to play.

 

[Rogerborg]

All true enough, but you can have fun with a cheap boltie even if it's not hugely accurate.  Thinking about it, I've been using mine more as a secondary.  I use the scope for spotting, and take situational shots with it, but quite often just prop it against a tree and go in with the SMG.  It's all good, as long as you don't expect YouTube sniper channel levels of success.

 

[Taiga]

I appreciated all the comments, I've had probably around 15-20 hours of research over the last week and a couple of days. While I would be alright with getting an AEG, I'm still set on having a AEP also (also still very much interested in glock's). I just don't like gas all that much and I have for more knowledge regarding electronics wise than I do gas.

Also I would like to put a budget into perspective, I started giving myself around £700 for my first year budget. After getting myself some clothes, belt, pouches, boots and what not I'm now on about £525, or somewhere in the £500 region. (Most of that budget went on some magnum boots which I've wanted for a while - The rest on British military gear, vests, trousers, pouches and so on.)

If I where to get an AEG, what are should I look into. My knowledge on AEG's ins't the best but the vast majority of people at my skirmishing site use modified AEG's, also we do have a tech guy at my local shop who's has a lot of experience with teching (so there's that option to, if I don't have the time that is).

 

[clumpyedge]

I appreciated all the comments, I've had probably around 15-20 hours of research over the last week and a couple of days. While I would be alright with getting an AEG, I'm still set on having a AEP also (also still very much interested in glock's). I just don't like gas all that much and I have for more knowledge regarding electronics wise than I do gas.

Also I would like to put a budget into perspective, I started giving myself around £700 for my first year budget. After getting myself some clothes, belt, pouches, boots and what not I'm now on about £525, or somewhere in the £500 region. (Most of that budget went on some magnum boots which I've wanted for a while - The rest on British military gear, vests, trousers, pouches and so on.)

If I where to get an AEG, what are should I look into. My knowledge on AEG's ins't the best but the vast majority of people at my skirmishing site use modified AEG's, also we do have a tech guy at my local shop who's has a lot of experience with teching (so there's that option to, if I don't have the time that is).

If you want some more help looking at the VSR range and upgrades etc head over to Eagle6 webpage and youtube channel. They are the masters of all things TM, likewise if you want even more technical help I'd suggest having a look at either the specific threads on here that already exist or getting in touch with longbow bb (jason ferguson).

 

[Rogerborg]

Lastly, is it worth looking into picking up a pre-upgraded sniper?

If budget is tight, that may be an option if you want something effective.  Have you asked around at your local site to see if anyone wants to shift one?  Just be aware that folk often over-value their pride-and-joys even when they're trying to shift them.

If money were no object, then sure, the TM G18 AEP would be fine.  But as it is, I'd give a qualified thumbs up to the CYMA AEPs.  Look at it this way, when money allows, that's £95 worth of upgrades you can apply: lipo, spring, hop rubber, barrel, bushings/bearings, all the good stuff.  They're TM compatible, the Eagle6 parts will fit fine.

 

[Taiga]

If budget is tight, that may be an option if you want something effective.  Have you asked around at your local site to see if anyone wants to shift one?  Just be aware that folk often over-value their pride-and-joys even when they're trying to shift them.

If money were no object, then sure, the TM G18 AEP would be fine.  But as it is, I'd give a qualified thumbs up to the CYMA AEPs.  Look at it this way, when money allows, that's £95 worth of upgrades you can apply: lipo, spring, hop rubber, barrel, bushings/bearings, all the good stuff.  They're TM compatible, the Eagle6 parts will fit fine.

Simply put, if I where to upgrade the whole kit and go LIPO on the TM and CYMA, it would actually then only be about a £30-£40 difference. Since the standard battery and charger for the marui are about £40 combined (which have to be brought separately, this is the main reason there's such a price difference). given that I went LIPO instead of the standard, and got an extra mag for both, the different is still only around £30-£40.

My main question for this statement is what could I get for £30-£40 in terms of upgrades, since if I got LIPO, it wont matter if I have a TM or CYMA, I'll still need to upgrade the internals to make sure it lasts.

 

[Rogerborg]

Simply put, if I where to upgrade the whole kit and go LIPO on the TM and CYMA, it would actually then only be about a £30-£40 difference. Since the standard battery and charger for the marui are about £40 combined (which have to be brought separately, this is the main reason there's such a price difference)

Ah, I didn't realise the TMs came without power as standard.  The nimh battery that comes with the CYMAs is functional, but lipo makes a big difference to both response and RoF, so I'd recommend that as the first modification to either gun.  It's about as simple as teching gets: just unsolder and remove the standard connector and solder on two wires from a JST connector and you're done.  It'll work out cheaper than buying a nimh battery and charger as well.