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Macks airsoft dreamers of the week thread

Jaylordofwaargh said:
Nohttps://prefired.co.uk/ads/tm-m4-cqbr-l192a-longsword/

Am I missing something or is this actually worth it? (No it isn't, even with the £109 million win)

Sure all the original bits are there sure there are some select parts involved and the work done by (i'm guessing) reputable techs....but! This looks like a high ball expecting lower end offers. 

Then consider what the person wants to swap for, it a joke right? 

So many things wrong when you also consider fps
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Unfortunately no he’s not joking and yes he is deadly serious with his asking price .

Take it your new’ish to the world of TM recoils as ‘Kingdom of airsoft’ has an almost mystical reputation with your really obsessive recoil fanboys , it takes literally mths to get him to even look at your gun AND then even more mths to get it done and back !
Dropping a grand on one of his ‘upgrades’ is the norm so yea 1,200 is nothing unusual .

 
Druid799 said:
Unfortunately no he’s not joking and yes he is deadly serious with his asking price .

Take it your new’ish to the world of TM recoils as ‘Kingdom of airsoft’ has an almost mystical reputation with your really obsessive recoil fanboys , it takes literally mths to get him to even look at your gun AND then even more mths to get it done and back !
Dropping a grand on one of his ‘upgrades’ is the norm so yea 1,200 is nothing unusual .
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Yes I am new ish to the world of tm recoil, it sits out of my normal budget, I like eating and rent is apparently a thing that I shouldn't miss. 

So this is a tech that can make tm recoils work with upgrades, capture the magic dust as it were, uh, fair enough. 

An ad for tm fan bois only then.

 
Let me get this straight. Twelve hundred quid for an Airsoft gun.

Regardless whether its been blessed by the Machine Gods of Warhammer 40k, or has a tungsten inner barrel with titanium gears and a 100000rpm motor that runs off a mini fusion reactor, or has xyz other features designed to impress Gear Geeks but with sod-all difference to the average player in a skirmish, it's still a plastic pellet-firing toy gun.

For twelve hundred quid.

Mental.

 
Jaylordofwaargh said:
Yes I am new ish to the world of tm recoil, it sits out of my normal budget, I like eating and rent is apparently a thing that I shouldn't miss. 

So this is a tech that can make tm recoils work with upgrades, capture the magic dust as it were, uh, fair enough. 

An ad for tm fan bois only then.
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It’s a running argument between the two main camps of TM recoil fan , on the one side(the side I’m on) you have the players who say leave well alone they don’t NEED to be upgraded bar sticking a deans on it . Then in the other are the ones who say it’ll become the ultimate BB slinger by basically changing near everything in it turn it in to ‘triggers broom’ , which my side thinks rather defies the point of having one in the first place ! ?

PS you can NEVER save or regain the magic dust once you crack the gearbox open .?

 
Not entirely sure what the point is in ejaculating a wodge of moolah on a posh, Gucci airsoft weapon then swapping out shitloads of bits in it for even more moolah. What's the benefit, aside from massaging one's overinflated ego or enhancing someone else's bank account?

I'll stick to my budget junk that does the same job, flinging plastic spheres at not-very-stunning velocities towards the opposing players...

 
Druid799 said:
It’s a running argument between the two main camps of TM recoil fan , on the one side(the side I’m on) you have the players who say leave well alone they don’t NEED to be upgraded bar sticking a deans on it . Then in the other are the ones who say it’ll become the ultimate BB slinger by basically changing near everything in it turn it in to ‘triggers broom’ , which my side thinks rather defies the point of having one in the first place ! ?

PS you can NEVER save or regain the magic dust once you crack the gearbox open .?
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Completely agree with this. Might as well buy a cheap and spend the money on the parts. 

125cc said:
Not entirely sure what the point is in ejaculating a wodge of moolah on a posh, Gucci airsoft weapon then swapping out shitloads of bits in it for even more moolah. What's the benefit, aside from massaging one's overinflated ego or enhancing someone else's bank account?

I'll stick to my budget junk that does the same job, flinging plastic spheres at not-very-stunning velocities towards the opposing players...
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I’ve just splashed out a small fortune on a psg1 which I have no doubt I will be doing small upgrades Too including buy a scope which it doesn’t with. Why you ask, because I want too. 

 
125cc said:
Let me get this straight. Twelve hundred quid for an Airsoft gun.

Regardless whether its been blessed by the Machine Gods of Warhammer 40k, or has a tungsten inner barrel with titanium gears and a 100000rpm motor that runs off a mini fusion reactor, or has xyz other features designed to impress Gear Geeks but with sod-all difference to the average player in a skirmish, it's still a plastic pellet-firing toy gun.

For twelve hundred quid.

Mental.
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Just you wait - £1200 is cheap compared to a lot of Systema PTW builds. An HAO-based build will be well over two grand, maybe closer to three with gucci real-steel bits hanging off it.

Than there's GBLS DAS, which is £1500-£1800 for the base gun.

 
Speedbird_666 said:
Just you wait - £1200 is cheap compared to a lot of Systema PTW builds. An HAO-based build will be well over two grand, maybe closer to three with gucci real-steel bits hanging off it.

Than there's GBLS DAS, which is £1500-£1800 for the base gun.
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Yup, spent well over that building Vectors lol

 
125cc said:
Not entirely sure what the point is in ejaculating a wodge of moolah on a posh, Gucci airsoft weapon then swapping out shitloads of bits in it for even more moolah. What's the benefit, aside from massaging one's overinflated ego or enhancing someone else's bank account?

I'll stick to my budget junk that does the same job, flinging plastic spheres at not-very-stunning velocities towards the opposing players...
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the same reason anyone does anything in this hobby- because they want to.

you can play with a goddamn nerf gun and get kills, so why are we even bothering with expensive cyma's?

there are folks who upgrade their guns because they think they need to do so to compete, there are folks who upgrade because they enjoy the process (like me), and there are folks like yourself and tackle who would rather save the money and gain their edge by other means such as fieldcraft or agility.

none of these approaches are right, but none of them are wrong either, and the fact that this is a hobby that can cater to such a variety of tastes and pockets is a good thing

 
Why would spend that much money on a RIF? Because you want to and/or you can. Why wouldn't you spend that much money on a RIF? Because you don't want to and/or you can't.

It's the one repeatedly occuring topic I'll never understand alongside gucci gear, not that it comes up... I absolutely understand that part. But how it can turn so personal/vitriolic. Said it before and I'll say it again, stop caring about what other people do/don't do with their hobby money (for me that extends to just 'in general') unless it actually affects you in a negative way.

Given what's in/on it I don't actually think the price is a million miles away from reasonable. That's a long ol' list of not particularly cheap things. I imagine that pair of p-mags alone isn't far off £100 by todays rates. Will it take someone in the market for those exact things (or close to) to pay that? Sure, but that's the case with RIF that's had internal/external work.

Edit: Just priced up what I'd consider the 'extras' (basically anything that isn't the RIF with the hi-cap) and that comes to about £750. A stock NGRS is £500ish? Plus the seemingly £1000 worth of stuff put in it by KoA. Not just saying it seems like a reasonable price to be a contrarian, by the usual given pricing advice on here it falls well within reasonable. Just because it's expensive doesn't mean it's over priced purely in financial terms. Would opinion lead some to believe it's over priced? Sure. But I think every P90 I see is overpriced because free is too expensive for what I'd pay.

One thing I would say though, for the asking price the ad is nowhere near fleshed out enough. There should be a detailed listing of what is actually in it rather than a 'go look it up yourself'.

 
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I don't think his issue is solely how much it is, it's the whole "why buy an expensive gun only to have to spend a shedload more it", to that end I'm in agreement, in much the same way I cringe when a new member posts up "just bought a new gun, not used it yet, what should I upgrade ?"

FFS, get out & play with it, whether it's a £100 gun or costs £1k, it'll usually do exactly what it's supposed to within the boundaries of physics, no amount of money spent will surmount the laws of physics while staying within site FPS limits ?

 
That was the point to my question Tackle... not bothered what people spend - its their business after all, I waste £££ on other stuff outside of airsoft. I didn't mean to bruise anyone's ego by asking the question. If someone has the hard-earned to throw parts at an already high-end gun that's their call, I'm just interested as to the thought process behind it. My view being (and it is only my view) that if I was a serious player looking to increase my competitiveness I'd rather look for a platform that already has what I'm looking for - and there are a lot of good choices out there (assuming they're in stock :lol: ) - any additions being very basic alterations such as a more comfortable stock or a different sight. Of course I understand that everyone has different wants and needs, and not all standard platforms offer "everything" to everyone. It's more the ripping apart of perfectly serviceable gearboxes, swapping motors, adding MOSFETs, farting about with different barrels, general binning of parts that out of the box I'd imagine would be perfectly adequate.

"FFS, get out & play with it, whether it's a £100 gun or costs £1k, it'll usually do exactly what it's supposed to within the boundaries of physics, no amount of money spent will surmount the laws of physics while staying within site FPS limits"... think this comment best sums it up really... I'm as big a tech-head as anyone, however as an engineer there's two principles I adhere to religiously - keep it simple, and if it works, don't faff with it...  :lol:

 
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125cc said:
Not entirely sure what the point is in ejaculating a wodge of moolah on a posh, Gucci airsoft weapon then swapping out shitloads of bits in it for even more moolah. What's the benefit, aside from massaging one's overinflated ego or enhancing someone else's bank account?

I'll stick to my budget junk that does the same job, flinging plastic spheres at not-very-stunning velocities towards the opposing players...
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Aaahh the innocents of the new player , if only he knew what’s ahead of him ! ???
Seriously though mate yes there expensive(but best things usually are)but no way I’d call the TM recoil range ‘posh or Gucci’ by any stretch of the imagination , those are two terms used when referring to kit that’s desirable but realistically no better than the cheaper versions you can get(like when you see squaddies tooling around Sennybridge wearing the what ever the SAS are wearing this season !) I genuinely believe (as do many other players)theres nothing on the market that’ll touch a TM recoil for range and accuracy out of the box , absolutely nothing .TM’s are about the only airsoft guns that you can turn around and say “yea the hype is true and there worth every penny” believe me it’s ALL true what people say about them .
Equally I believe you have to be off your trog to sink hundreds and hundreds of pounds in to them as they’ll never be as reliable as they where before ‘upgrading’ them . ?

 
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125cc said:
 It's more the ripping apart of perfectly serviceable gearboxes, swapping motors, adding MOSFETs, farting about with different barrels, general binning of parts that out of the box I'd imagine would be perfectly adequate.
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To answer that part, it's largely the fact that Marui's are set up purely for the Japanese market and they couldn't give a rats about anywhere else. The fact they come in 'low' FPS wise by the laws over here means many want to get that additional 70 FPS (give or take) out of them. But doing so puts additional strain on other gearbox components and such the 'upgrade' train starts-a-rollin'. Do you need to? As covered earlier it's, for some reason or another, hotly debated... but that's the reasoning. Ultimately 'adequate' is very much a subjective term, having been around the hobby for a long time it's easy for me to forget that stock parts from other manufacturers have come a long way... but I'll never trust brass barrels ?.

 
I don't deny it... the old adage of "you get what you pay for" is true in all walks of life, I have never tried a TM but am pretty sure they will be far, far superior to any 100-quid CYMA or LT that green rookies like meself wield!

Anyway, sorry for derailing the thread everyone... back on topic and all that.

 
Tackle said:
I don't think his issue is solely how much it is, it's the whole "why buy an expensive gun only to have to spend a shedload more it", to that end I'm in agreement.
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it's a tricky one, on the one hand i do agree that if you're gonna trigger's broom an aeg, might as well start with a cheaper platform.

however the exception to that is when the base platform offers something that isn't really plausible for a cheaper gat, in the tm recoils case it's the other features such as, well, the recoil, that make it a desirable starter (whether or not you care about recoil is a different matter)

same as how an e&l ak sure as shit looks a lot prettier and has stronger external components than a cyma. which if you have my crippling addiction to blued steel is something worth paying for.

Tackle said:
In much the same way I cringe when a new member posts up "just bought a new gun, not used it yet, what should I upgrade ?"
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i completely agree with this

*looks at his desk covered in unskirmished e&l guts and aftermarket parts*

do as i say not as i do :P

 
Now, I was gonna weigh in and then thought to myself  I really can't be asked because most of you all know where I stand when it comes to TM recoils :D  so I'll just say a few words..... not many.... just a few...

I've been in and out of airsoft since 2005 and I've seen all kinds of pews. Crap ones, good ones, wannabe ones and 'you-can't-touch-this' ones. I remember when the first recoils came out the price point was pretty high  and I recall how people ridiculed the platform back then and for some reason many still do to this day. Then the Systema came out circa 2008 and boy oh boy oh boy... the Systema haters materialised literally over night... It was incredible the back talking you'd get when you'd go to a game.....  but you know what? That's what I had, that's what I wanted to play with and that's what I spent my money on. For all those TM and PTW haters there were scores more who loved seeing the new platforms and asked questions and wanted to have a go.... and many still do today....

Now we all know a stock TM recoil is a bloody good pew pew and it does what it says on the tin... yes the average price is about £500.... and I accept it's a lot of money.... However, you can chose to leave it alone and play with 0.28g bbs and shoot accurately up to 40-45m.  Or you can make it even better if you so wish to... You can elevate a TM recoil to the near halo heights of Systema God-like range and accuracy. Yes I've said it... 'God-like' and especially more so if it's a Tackleberry PTW. Those who have one and have played with one will know what I mean.  The only platform that comes close out of the box to a Systema is the GBLS-DAS (so I've heard) and a mate of mine has bought one and we will put them both to the test but that's a different story for another day.....

There are some great TM builders out there namely E6, KoA and CAMO... these guys know how to take a TM and elevate it to near Systema performance...some may even say better.... and yes it costs money..... a lot of money.... Will it make you a better player? Maybe? Who knows? Will it put a smile on your face each time you pull the trigger? Hell yes! So why do it? Well that's easy to answer.... Coz we want to. Coz we are intrigued on what we can get out of the platform... Coz we can. Coz we simply love to tinker......  That's the beauty of this hobby... You can put a little into it or as much as you want into it.... 

Oh FFS, I've said a few more words than I wanted to.....  hey ho!

 
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