Want a Ppq

[Davegolf]

Really want a Walther PPQ as my field sidearm, anyone have some real world feedback on options and extended use?

Ive got a great primary pistol, but want a lighter smaller backup

Cheers all ?

 

[Davegolf]

Tumbleweed... is that telling or??

 

[heroshark]

There's a fairly in-depth youtube vid I found when I was wondering. Basically it's not good.

 

[Cromulon1994]

Had a plink. Awful trigger. Also used by the worst bond. It's not really got much going for it.

 

[Davegolf]

Lol @Cromulon1994 ?

Cheers @heroshark I've trawled a lot, there are some reports of slide cracking but I think that was the early releases.

Most seem positive...

What appealed to me is the speed and blowback, of which I think will make it very reliable year round here in Blighty.

And most seemed to have a nice short reset too.

Was hoping for some AFUK users...

Feck it I bought one, il know for sure that way ??

 

[Davegolf]

Looks like FS must have had their monitoring systems trawling AFUK...

It arrived today, so ive been in ownership for a full 8hrs and have a wealth of experience ?

Here comes a preliminary findings for anyone interested in this pistol, as in my OP i was looking for a lightweight sidearm for my field and milsim days where i have quite a bit of gear.

• What with wanting a light pistol that means a polymer / modern type frame.
  
• I have relatively large hands, i wanted ease of operation with 'proper' gloves - not nano thin, Durex sensitive types - so large trigger guard and grip with obvious controls.
  
• Despite above requirement i wanted a compact pistol - less bulk and profile for running / reduced snagging on fauna.
  
• Ambi controls as i generally rifle right handed and pistol left handed - a great perk for drawing your sidearm.
  

Through all this i settled on the VFC made PPQ M2 GBB, despite my massive reservations about buying anything other than a TM. I did consider a Glock build but couldnt be bothered with the tinkering, also been there and done that before - great pistol performance wise in the end but not for big hands personally.

Having been pleasantly surprised with the ASG below and ASGs Scorpion from a functionality and performance POV i went for it.

This glove is a tight fit across my palm @ 4" / 100mm.

These gloves are heavy gauge leather. (and a shiny "new 4 months ago" pair at that to replace the olds, that some unexpected freak of nature event seems to have stopped them from being used ?)

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Historically due to the big hands in gloves ive run big guns like HiCapa's, FNX, or currently the CZ Shadow as my CQB guns. For comparison in size and weight;

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Size wise the fit and grip for me is perfect, although it looks a little short in the pistol grip i can assure you i have a full and proper hold around the base, unlike a PX4 i once owned or the usual compact class guns.

I dont think this is actually classified as a compact, but it must only be a few millimeters shy of the requirement to qualify as one!

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There seems to be a lot of negative hype about this pistol online, and its generally harder to find good news than bad for sure - but thus far im very impressed...

GENERAL FIT AND FINISH

• Quality feeling polymer / not TM ABS vom, there is a seam on the underside but not offensive - if this becomes a keeper il prob sand and Cerakote anyways.
  
  
  Has removable backstrap, but you only get one... go figure!
  

[*]Slide is aluminium of sorts, cant say what grade but it actually looks far better machined and detailed than a lot of aftermarket slides - inside and out.

• 
  
  The finish is a matt applied coating that seems well bonded, way more so than ASG or WE,s attempts.
  
• There has been cracked / split slide reports, weather this is isolated to early production models (a good few years ago now) or abuse (lots of people full auto-ing these / higher power gas etc) or is still inherent only time will tell.
  
• As is the case with most tilting barrel designs the front of the 'ejection port' does polish/rub.
  

[*]Full correct trades and nice grip texture, high quality moulding work with logos contrasting gloss/matt/textured.

[*]Slide to frame fitment is good, minimal wobble but can be moved sideways up front forcefully.

• 
  
  Inner barrel rattles if the pistol is violently shaken.
  

[*]All controls and the mags fit very nicely - i would have liked a metal trigger, nut sure if the RS one has?

[*]Nice aluminium iron sights, rear is windage adjustable, both solidly fixed.




MAGAZINES

• Nicely made and looking, Walther, PPQ and 9mm markings
  
• Plastic base plate - looks pretty strong but without actually dropping it not sure on its actual impact resistance, it will 'self-test' inevitably at some point! ?
  
• Feed lips look extremely well formed i must say.
  
• Silent type fill valve, soft and supple gas route.
  
• Big gas reservoir, especially relative to BB capacity.
  
• Fit in the magwell is nice, they drop out nicely too.
  
• Oh loading BB's... dont know what that guy in the video was on loading the BBs one at a time through the feed lips, just pull the follower down a fire them in the front like most other pistol mags ?
  

INTERNALS

• All look pretty well made, usual pot ally and steel mixup.
  
• The trigger bar is nicely made from stamped steel.
  
• Full aluminium BBU
  
• Looks to be a proprietary piston lid seal ?
  
• Nozzle is nicely made, BBU functions very nicely from an efficiency, fit and return spring POV.
  
• Nozzle and bucking mate very well with full seal retained whilst slide cycles back ?
  
• Metal outer barrel, Brass inner - 85mm long
  

CONTROLS

• Slide release - positive engagement, polymer / metal combo.
  
• Slide lock, good function on duster / green / mid power gas, but wont catch powerful fast gas on stock recoil spring, at least not with these 20c temps ATM.
  
  
  Love that this pistol is one that automatically releases the slide when a new mag is inserted following a mag empty / slide lock back. My CZ does this also, not sure if its actually a design flaw but i think its great for speed reloads and reduced slide lock wear.
  
• Release levers are ambi, metal construction, and long. Personally i think they are too long and are a negative to the PPQ design, Garand Thumb covers this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krZt22UiPDk&t=978s
  
• Im going to mill them down to prevent accidental activation (lock back and release) of the slide.
  

[*]Mag release - positive engagement and action, polymer / metal combo

• 
  
  Can be switched from left to right side.
  
• Obvious to operate, but bumper is nice and prevents accidental drop.
  

[*]Trigger - awesome trigger, this was a big selling point to me. I have had quite a lot of pistols over the years, and tuned a lot too. Got my TM P226 trigger nice but not on the same level as the ASG CZ Shadow ( ican see why its used for IPSC), this PPQ trigger smashes the CZ.

• 
  
  Pretty much all GBB pistols ive owned have a stodgy vague pull to the wall, further to that most of them creep - by that i mean the wall can move or disappear, then the gun ghost fires. This can be tuned or worked out, but there are limitations to glitter rolling.
  
• The CZ trigger is very nice (in SAO), it has a light pull and obvious wall (although soft). It is consistent and repeatable with no creep, reset is short, light but consistent - all in all a proper fast trigger you need sensitivity for, no wonder its great for IPSC. But not the best for rough-tough-glove action in the field!
  
• This PPQ trigger is a dream, the pull is light, clean and short just like the CZ, but the wall is solid - again no creep. From here the pull/fire is crisp and short, reset is very short and very obvious - very impressed.
  
• Being a strike fire type it has a Glock style safety - again great for field work, holstered hot.
  

PERFORMANCE

• 0.2s with Vertex pretty consistent 280 FPS
  
• Getting 3 full mags on one gas fill with steady / sporadic firing
  
• Getting 1.5-2 full mags on one gas fill with furious rapid fire
  
• Recoil is hard and very fast - another selling point, a lot of TMs are lazy in this department i feel.
  

RANGE AND ACCURACY

• Will get back to you on that, seriously windy ATM.
  

PROBLEMS

• Sometimes the slide doesnt return fully home, causing gas vent through barrel, i think this is an easy fix though
  
• UPDATE the issue above turned out to be the hammer reset, basically theres a rocking triangle that contacts the slide, which in turn resets the hammer. The radius on this triangle is a bit to small which means the slide uses considerable energy to initiate the hammer reset. I removed this part and filed a larger smoother radius so that ti transitions with much less effort.
  

All in all pretty pleased with this at the outset, 12 mags though it, such a crisp little gun ?

 

[heroshark]

Nice. To correct my first post it was actually the vp9. I was looking at. Be interested to see how it goes. The umarex springer has a metal trigger. It's a great springer went to look for my pics and review but I haven't done one yet I must rectify that.

If it doesn't work out the tm usp compact is a very nice snappy reliable compact. Should hopefully tick enough of the boxes . Not full lefty controls but you can work around it. I also carry/draw on the left in conjunction with a rifle.

 

[FreeFrag.UK]

I must admit, I've looked at the PPQ many times since discovering the "Duty Kit" or whatever the pack is called which provides a compatible suppressor.

Admittedly at the moment I'm waiting on stock to come in for a Tokyo Marui Glock 19 although I've been tempted by a couple different options out there, including a Shadow (I have a CZ-75 for my Cech kit and the mag's are supposedly compatible).

A very good write up and a very thorough one.

 

[Davegolf]

@heroshark oh i see, i really like the VP9, but ive not been convinced by any airsoft versions. I wonder if the springers metal trigger would fit??

@FreeFrag.UK cheers, yes there is a silencer kit about if you wanted a primary i suppose, or a longer draw sidearm.

Very impressed with the Shadow OOTB, feed it powerful gas though so it can work fast, as it was made for C02 really - but i hate those mags.

In the workshop today with much investigation i sorted the issue / design flaw i happened across. It definitely pumps out BBs now, well happy. Had about 30 mags through it now!

I will strip it down again now its all sorted and just do some house keeping in side, smooth everything so its operation is Uber slick.

For any potential owners/tinkerers be very aware if you remove the hammer assembly from the frame, this spring is retianed with absolutely nothing!

The offending aforementioned triangular follower can be seen at the very top.

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A pic of the proprietary piston lid / BBU seal

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[heroshark]

I've had a p99 break, same trigger but without the safe. 

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[Davegolf]

Had a chance to do some wind free shooting, initially setting the hop for Geoff 0.28s - of which it will happily over hop.

The first 4 mag fulls were great, consistently hitting my 200mm square gong at 20M, after moving the target out to 25M and doing another mag it was starting to suffer cool down badly, the BBU getting pretty damn frosty impeding proper functionality. Thus ending play for today.

EDIT: the increased gas consumption impeding functionality was down to the piston lid seal, dry as you like, which is not unexpected considering the 20 mags since i lubed it last.

With that in mind id say it most definitely isnt as gas efficient as a TM, not because it has an aluminium slide because that thing weighs nothing, but because the BBU is simply more gas hungry by design. This does make the pistol fly though, double edged sword i guess.

EDIT: the piston lid seal is definitely on the looser side, meaning a decent amount of gas speed is needed to enlarge the cup so it seals against the nozzle - hence the lower efficiency.

Unlike the CZ, love that pistol but to big and heavy for a secondary.

I think all the neg hype about for this pistol is undue, it is a very field-able sidearm, would i buy another? probably not but it serves its intended purpose for me.

I REALLY enjoy shooting pistols, i may need another

 

[heroshark]

Did you watch badabings review . Mentions it works better with some aftermarket valves 

 

[Davegolf]

Did he do a review on the PPQ?

 

[heroshark]

Did he do a review on the PPQ?

Aye bud. I'd give you a link but I can't be seen to be too helpful, it's against my nature. 

 

[Davegolf]

@heroshark I did search for it, old / deleted video maybe?? When did you last see it?

I thought id have a look into the magazines as they are very tricky to fill up just the right amount, upon removing the fill valve there are no gas tubes / dip tubes which explains the difficulty in puttin genough in, but no over filling.

Ive ordered some 3mm brass tube so i can machine gas tubes into the fill vlaves.

 

[heroshark]

@heroshark I did search for it, old / deleted video maybe?? When did you last see it?

My bad  . I've done it again it was the hk45ct . That said still may use the same valve. He mentions the umarex/vfc glock they use same mag valve also so they may use them across the board.

 

[Davegolf]

Its cool, you were just being "helpful" ?