Airsoft Forums UK

That's the very same reason why the US Army hasn't updated the M16's and M4's gas system. It's a 40 year old design and possibly the worst in the modern firearms industry, and H&K developed the HK416 as an alternative for the US military- however indeed it would cost too much to replace all the existing weapons in the US Military's arsenal. It would even cost too much to develop and implement a modification kit for the M4/M16's gas system.

Very true Lozart. That's the reason why the US still use standard M4/ M16 rifles instead of all these brilliamt, more modern M416's, SR25's etc etc. They simply do not have the money nor resources to reequip every soilder with all this new gear let alone a whole new ammunition.

In fact, with the 416 you don't even have to replace the entire weapon. You can just swap the uppers over. Still won't happen though.

and highly unlikely that a 'laser rifle' would ever be used. That's the land of Hollywood, to get a laser to fatally wound someone at distances up to a mile would require some serious technology. Your talking thousands to make just one. If the military can't equip todays soldiers with simple firearm upgrades from a prehistoric AR , it's highly unlikely any military will ever have laser rifles.

the US Army alone has 5 hundred thousand M4 carbines... at a conservative estimate of $1500 an upper (including servicing contracts, spares, etc) that's $750,000,000 and that's just the Army... USMC, USAF, USN is probably the same again; 5.56 on the standard AR platform isn't going anywhere any time soon!

The L115A3 is only issued in the .338 variation, as far as I know.

Other variations exist, but they don't have military applications.

L85 = Individual weapon

L129 = DMR

L115 = LRR

Any other cartridges it can fire are just pointless because the roles they'd provide are covered by the other weapon platforms issued.

Why doesn't someone make a thread?

The L115A3 fires both .300 and .338 rounds. They use .300 rounds for midrange engagements and killing HVT's. If they used a .338 round at midrange it would near obliterate the target making them impossible to verify hence the less powerful round. Plus a .338 round travels faster than a .300 due to more powder so if a .338 round was used at midrange it would travel too fast through the target and not 'tear' as it penetrates. Meaning the target has a higher chance of survival.

oh please no.

A .338 round would just have so much kinetic energy due to reaching it's target at such short range it would most likely just rip the body apart. It's more "humane" to use a .300 round if you will. Yes, you want to kill your target but not mutilate them in the process.

However the Americans do not care for this and would happily use a .50 BMG round from an M82 at any distance, tearing their target apart then giggle over seeing "their arm fly off".

Oh good it's bash the Americans time.

if that's classed as american bashing then they need to nut the f*ck up the sissy bastards

Let me join in!

You really think our guys on the ground carry a second barrel, bolt and ammo around? Have you picked up an L115A3? I'd rather lug a SAW around. They keep them chambered in .338 all the time. If there were targets at a range where they'd give a single grain of shit about what happens to the target, they'd just get a bloke with an L85 or L129 to slot him instead.

Also, a .338 round is going to turn the target inside out at any range. Target ID isn't going to be any easier for a longer range shot. These rounds can outshoot .50 Cals, the effective range is less but the L115 holds the distance record.

I was just joking about the laser btw

It seems you've started a very emotive and interesting thread james, well done Sah! Lots of very good and well informed opinions and some...not so...

But the economics bit is spot on, the MoD paid H&K £93million to upgrade the L85A1 to A2, the cost of replacing with M16/M4s? £400million, its not the weapons that cost, its the 20 years of spares, it the training aids (Like SAT) and publications and maintenance. When you look at the development that H&K conducted,...

first the L85 then the 416, reliability like that had never been dreamed of! I ammo argument will go on and on, but for comparison, it isn't always calibre, just look at the M193 (US, Vietnam era, used by British forces in the Falklands and NI) compared to the SS109 (Belgium and now NATO standard), both 5.56mm, but very different effects on target.

isn't this surpassing the 73 comment record?!