Jump to content

Is there a way for a 16yo to get a RIF?


T800pug
 Share

This thread is over three months old. Please be sure that your post is appropriate as it will revive this otherwise old (and possibly forgotten) topic.

Recommended Posts

To put it simple how would a 16 year old go about getting a RIF? I've seen many people advertise different ways and that's there's down and upsides to it.  Many friends and I often attend the same airsoft site with our two tones guns however we want to expand are arsenal and get higher end guns, one thing me and my friends agree on is that if we want to purchase high end rifles we want something that will last us a long time and wont have tacky blue red or green paint on it.  Would it be possible for a gradian to get a ukara and purchase a RIF to gift to us? Could you contact a friend with a ukara and ask them to get you one as a "gift"?

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So your parents aren't involved?

The easiest would be for a parent to play three games to get UKARA registered.

Yes, anyone with UKARA can gift you a RIF.

 

 

Edited by EDcase
Link to comment
Share on other sites

31 minutes ago, EDcase said:

So your parents aren't involved?

The easiest would be for a parent to play three games to get UKARA registered.

Yes, anyone with UKARA can gift you a RIF.

 

 

My Dad is decently old being 53 not sure he wants to play. Could he turn up pay the fee then leave the game after 10 minutes and go home? Or does he have to be there for the full day?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Note that ‘gifting’ has to be a gift.

If you identify any friend with UKARA that is willing to be the middleman of a sale of a RIF (or also an IF) to a 16 year old then they are committing an offence 

 

Under 18 you cannot buy an IF or RIF

 

But you can be given an IF or RIF which is where ‘gifting’ comes in.

That is why parents usually get referenced

 

If a UKARA holding adult wants to give a decent quality RIF to a 16 year old then be worried about their motivations 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporters

UKARA is proof that the holder is an airsofter. If the venue you go would give him a membership for turning up 3 times in not less than 2 months, and they are on the UKARA scheme, then your dad would get that proof and could buy a RIF that he could gift to you.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

45 minutes ago, Samurai said:

UKARA is proof that the holder is an airsofter. If the venue you go would give him a membership for turning up 3 times in not less than 2 months, and they are on the UKARA scheme, then your dad would get that proof and could buy a RIF that he could gift to you.

Thank you, I'm going to try convince him to get one as a Christmas present for me. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've heard some say the age restriction part of the VCRA only applies to the sale of rifs, not the modifying an IF to a RIF part so the OP could change or paint the snot green parts. 

 

However, I wouldn't take this as gospel as you don't want to be the test case in the unlikely event you end up in court and something tells me "some guy on the internet said it's ok" wouldn't be a good defence 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Cannonfodder said:

I've heard some say the age restriction part of the VCRA only applies to the sale of rifs, not the modifying an IF to a RIF part so the OP could change or paint the snot green parts. 

 

However, I wouldn't take this as gospel as you don't want to be the test case in the unlikely event you end up in court and something tells me "some guy on the internet said it's ok" wouldn't be a good defence 

Almost as iffy as ,'I bought it from a bloke in the pub' 🙂

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporters
12 hours ago, T800pug said:

Could he turn up pay the fee then leave the game after 10 minutes and go home?

 

Entirely up to the site. UKARA (and equivalent schemes) are just centralised registers of site memberships.  It would be a crappy thing to do to any site that's running limited numbers of players, since he'll be taking a place away from an actual player, and not buying any consumables.

 

I mention this because there's a difference between legality and morality.

 

What I will note is that there's no age limit on the defence for modifying an IF into a RIF [edit - see below]. If you are an active airsoft player, you can adduce that defence, and there's no statutory requirement to have a UKARA number (because there's no definition of the defence in the statute, or even in the regulation that added our defence, it's in an accompanying circular, and suggestive).  In plain language: if you're an active airsoft skirmisher, you can paint your two tone, same as anybody else.

 

Or practically speaking, private sellers tend not to care as much about defences.  Legally speaking, if I were selling to your parent, and they could provide evidence that it would be gifted to and used by an active airsoft skirmisher (of any age) then I'd be fine with it.  That would apply even more if you could find someone at your local site(s) who's looking to sell.

 

 

13 hours ago, T800pug said:

high end rifles we want something that will last us a long time

 

Those things should go together, but airsoft doesn't work that way.  The cheapest CYMAs are cockroach tough, while VFCs can come pre-broken.  Unmeddled TMs might qualify.  Just don't expect startlingly better performance than your Lancer. 

 

 

1 hour ago, Cannonfodder said:

I've heard some say the age restriction part of the VCRA only applies to the sale of rifs, not the modifying an IF to a RIF part so the OP could change or paint the snot green parts. 

 

However, I wouldn't take this as gospel as you don't want to be the test case in the unlikely event you end up in court and something tells me "some guy on the internet said it's ok" wouldn't be a good defence 

 

Fair point, but the VCRA isn't secret and S36 (offences) and S37 (defences) don't make any mention of age.  Age is an issue for Firearms Act 1968 S24A, which applies to the sale and the purchase of imitation firearms.

 

The inconsistency there is off the charts, given that there's no VCRA offence of purchasing a RIF (at any age).  Which gets to another piece of lawyer-bait, whether the same item can be an imitation firearm for the purposes of the Firearms Act, and a realistic imitation firearm for the purposes of VCRA.

 

I say yes, of course it can, while other people argue equally passionately that something can't be both a firearm (for FA) and a realistic imitation firearm (for VCRA), i.e. airgun replicas.

 

As you say, test cases, test cases, test cases.

 

But if OP is going to be sensible with his use, it won't be his test case.  And if he's not, then the VCRA will be the least of his worries as he'll be looking at Firearms Act offences first and foremost.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

But if OP is going to be sensible with his use, it won't be his test case.  And if he's not, then the VCRA will be the least of his worries as he'll be looking at Firearms Act offences first and foremost.

Agreed. I get the feeling that any charges relating to RIFs and the VCRA would be on a list of other more serious crimes. 

 

I always feel a bit iffy giving out info on loopholes on kids getting rifs on a public forum. While the OP's intentions are honest, little Johnny chav who wants something to wave around in the park and impress his chavvy mates wont be

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporters
10 minutes ago, Cannonfodder said:

little Johnny chav who wants something to wave around in the park and impress his chavvy mates wont be

 

Oh, it's always a risk, there was a 15 year old who straight up begged his way to being bought a bunch of RIFs by sweaty nonces strange men on Facebook, without having played a game. Naysayers were told to knock off them negative waves.  Of course, instead of skirmishing, he then went on spree of public photography, including posing on his rooftop. 🙄

 

OP is at least claiming to have played, and practically speaking, there's nothing stopping anyone hitting their dayglo with a rattlecan of best Poundland black.  Even asking the question is a decent sign.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I apricate everyone! From the sounds of it my dad isn't interested in the slightest and dislikes the idea of having his name and id connected to anything about "guns" I think I may end up replacing the barrel or stock then too make it a rif

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I also reached out to someone about purchasing his glock (RIF) from a second hand website, I asked him if it was ok to purchase and gave him a description of my history and why I don't have a ukara in the first place and offered to send him photos. It was already sold by the point he responded but he said he would have been fine with that. Is this common or was it a very lucky chance?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 hours ago, T800pug said:

My Dad is decently old being 53 not sure he wants to play. Could he turn up pay the fee then leave the game after 10 minutes and go home? Or does he have to be there for the full day?

Note that the VCRA requirement for airsoft is that RIFs are sold for the purposes of airsofting at an insured site.

The UKARA scheme sits on top of site memberships, and the 3 game requirement is to demonstrate the player actually wants to play

 

If your father was to turn up then leave then a site should not endorse those appearances as they make a mockery to the UKARA scheme and the sites membership of a scheme designed to protect their industry 

1 hour ago, T800pug said:

I also reached out to someone about purchasing his glock (RIF) from a second hand website, I asked him if it was ok to purchase and gave him a description of my history and why I don't have a ukara in the first place and offered to send him photos. It was already sold by the point he responded but he said he would have been fine with that. Is this common or was it a very lucky chance?

It’s down to each individual seller.

 

Some may stick to UKARA or another valid defence, some may not care at all and others may accept a buyers generalised history of playing airsoft 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporters
7 hours ago, Rogerborg said:

practically speaking, private sellers tend not to care as much about defences.

 

^^^

Although legally speaking, as you're under 18 it's an offence for you to buy it, and for him to sell it. There's no defence for that - you need the gifting-from-parent wheeze to get around it.

 

It's really not that hard to buy RIFs, especially 2nd hand: just don't volunteer information unless you're asked.  However, I'd sound a note of caution: a realistic gas-blowback pistol is a lot easier and more tempting to mis-use than a two-tone rifle.

 

Being completely honest with yourself, are you sure, are you absolutely certain, that you're not going to be tempted to take a pistol round to your mate's house to show it off, just once?  I'd check if your parents are OK with it first.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

^^^

Although legally speaking, as you're under 18 it's an offence for you to buy it, and for him to sell it. There's no defence for that - you need the gifting-from-parent wheeze to get around it.

 

It's really not that hard to buy RIFs, especially 2nd hand: just don't volunteer information unless you're asked.  However, I'd sound a note of caution: a realistic gas-blowback pistol is a lot easier and more tempting to mis-use than a two-tone rifle.

 

Being completely honest with yourself, are you sure, are you absolutely certain, that you're not going to be tempted to take a pistol round to your mate's house to show it off, just once?  I'd check if your parents are OK with it first.

I'm not like that and my parents have a deep hate for guns and it took alot of convincing them to let me start airsoft in the first place, if I ever did that and was caught by them not even the police I would be kicked out. Due to my dads place of work it would look TERRIBLE for me to get a charge for a situation like that. I also have to keep my airsoft guns and bow n' arrows in a locked case in the utility room removing the option for me to do that even if I wanted too. 

However my parents don't mind what I spend my money on along as it falls under the other rules as they see it as my money that I earned not there's so they "don't have control" over what financial decisions I make

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, T800pug said:

However my parents don't mind what I spend my money on along as it falls under the other rules as they see it as my money that I earned not there's so they "don't have control" over what financial decisions I make

Do the "other rules" include not breaking the law? Because that's what you'll be doing buying an airsoft gun, regardless of whether it's a rif or if. 

 

It'd be wiser to keep the parents on your side as it'll show a level of maturity and mean they're more likely to be accommodating to your interest in airsoft

 

Edit: another alternative to cover the bright paint on a 2 tone is a roll of sniper tape. Relatively cheap (should be about a fiver), can be put on and removed on site and will keep everything above board

Edited by Cannonfodder
Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 hours ago, Cannonfodder said:

Do the "other rules" include not breaking the law? Because that's what you'll be doing buying an airsoft gun, regardless of whether it's a rif or if. 

 

It'd be wiser to keep the parents on your side as it'll show a level of maturity and mean they're more likely to be accommodating to your interest in airsoft

 

Edit: another alternative to cover the bright paint on a 2 tone is a roll of sniper tape. Relatively cheap (should be about a fiver), can be put on and removed on site and will keep everything above board

Interesting idea with the sniper tape may be a good idea for a marksman's, also they dont mind me buying the airsoft gun its self I don't know why but that's how they are.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporters
1 hour ago, T800pug said:

also they dont mind me buying the airsoft gun its self I don't know why

 

Presumably they don't know that you're committing a criminal offence, with no defence or exception.

 

I mention this as (mostly) a technicality, since you've already got one.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This thread is a little worrisome as I feel discussing potential loopholes which can enable a *gulp* “child” to purchase an item only legally available to an “adult”, is detrimental to our beloved hobby. The only way this kid should be able to possess a rif is if his dad is a ukara registered player or his father buys a two tone and gifts it to the lad. 
The lad is actively seeking ways to break the law and we as a community should not be offering options to enable him. 
True it’s tough on him, but my dad wasn’t even around at his age let alone buying me cool shit. It’s called childhood, and when you get to a certain again you can buy what the hell you want; fill yer boots! 
If I was his dad, I’d be asking who the fuck bought him his two tone, and what did he have to do to have it “gifted” nudge nudge. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporters
13 hours ago, SBoardley said:

This thread is a little worrisome

 

More so than airsoft retailers selling without a real defence?

 

Going by what we've been told, his parents are commendably cautious, know about (but don't approve of) his IF, and it's securely stored between game days.  That's what will protect our hobby, not the laws around selling and buying which are more honoured in the breach than the observance.

 

And the harsh reality is that anyone can get a RIF by the application of a little paint, or by buying 2nd hand from someone who doesn't ask for a defence.  I wouldn't recommend that OP do either of those, but telling him not to won't actually prevent it.  We're not his dad, so to speak.

 

Sniper tape is a decent compromise, and the one I'd advocate.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

To add to ‘sniper tape’, there are two to three types:

 

1) Camouflage patterned sticky tape 

This varies in quality and can be a good finish or a sticky mess

Any level of quality will leave sticky residue so is on a practical basis a ‘permanent’ solution unless you want to spend time cleaning up gunky residue when / if it gets removed 

 

2) Cohesive bandage which only sticks to itself and also gives good grip 

This may be marketed as a sniper / hunter wrap tape in a few camouflage patterns (which often gets price markups)

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Pinsheng-Reusable-Camouflage-Self-Adhesive-Non-Woven/dp/B09GY4WTKK/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?crid=2RPUYXJQX147Q&keywords=camo+foam+tape&qid=1664883118&qu=eyJxc2MiOiIzLjIzIiwicXNhIjoiMC4wMCIsInFzcCI6IjAuMDAifQ%3D%3D&sprefix=camoform%2Caps%2C81&sr=8-3

 

 

or as vetinary / horse tape which can be had at a reasonable price if you can find a good ‘country stores’ or a friendly vet.

This is available in very wide ranges of bright & dull colours, pretty patterns and camouflages

…. And both via the internet 

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Cohesive-elastic-bandages-SUPERIOR-camouflage/dp/B07CHXBCJQ/ref=mp_s_a_1_4?crid=37VILCLHU6KMC&keywords=equestrian+vet+wrap+green+camouflage&qid=1664883360&qu=eyJxc2MiOiIxLjAxIiwicXNhIjoiMC4wMCIsInFzcCI6IjAuMDAifQ%3D%3D&sprefix=equestrian+vet+wrap+green+camouflage%2Caps%2C69&sr=8-4

 

 

3) British Army sniper tape in ‘ally’ green which can leave nasty residue.

This can be sourced from some army surplus shops (especially near barracks etc) at varying price levels and at uplifted prices on eBay etc when accompanied by the description ‘SAS sniper tape’

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fabric-Webbing-Scapa-Genuine-British/dp/B00HBTYC7A

 

But …. More importantly, keep your parents on board

 

They may dislike guns, but are showing a good point of view in supporting you with playing the hobby.

Attitude is the winner - if you are responsible, don’t act like a gun nut, do act like a hobbiest who plays consensual activities of shooting friends in a safe environment then you can enjoy this for years / decades 

 

 

The colour of an IF/RIF has no bearing on its capability 

If someone on a game day thinks you’re a silly kid with a bright toy BB gun then let them think that and shoot them all day

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I apricate it everyone! I think for my assult rifle im going to buy IF and try this wrap however I'm going to approach a second hand seller online with the permission from my parents for a pistol. ♥

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This thread is over three months old. Please be sure that your post is appropriate as it will revive this otherwise old (and possibly forgotten) topic.

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...