Safety - Medical Kit

[steve1462]

morning all!

 

Does anyone carry a first aid kit on them at all whilst playing? I've just put one (very compact but quite well kitted out that I normally take camping) in a small pouch onto my back.

 

I've been toying with the idea for a while as I've seen some pretty bad injuries in various sites and just wondered if anyone else keeps one / feedback etc?

 

Steve

[Shamal]

3 minutes ago, steve1462 said:

morning all!

 

Does anyone carry a first aid kit on them at all whilst playing? I've just put one (very compact but quite well kitted out that I normally take camping) in a small pouch onto my back.

 

I've been toying with the idea for a while as I've seen some pretty bad injuries in various sites and just wondered if anyone else keeps one / feedback etc?

 

Steve

Hi Steve.

Yes I always carry a viper medical.

Plenty of plasters,antiseptic wipes,pins,scissors.

Morphine,intravenous drip and compact defibrillator.

Gets a bit heavy but I have jettisoned the oxygen cylinder now.lol

But seriously i do always tote one. I'm on blood thinners so I do bleed a lot!🤕

Regards

 

 

[Tommikka]

I don’t carry a kit when playing, but have a first aid kit in the car, and a selection in my gear.

I always have access to a selection of painkillers, plasters and/or spray/rub on ‘plaster’, anti histamine, aniseptic cream etc

 

If you have specific needs then take what’s necessary (and if you have a condition ensure the staff are aware)

 

The site should have a first aid kit with sufficient quantity and types of items suitable for the site, numbers of people etc, and first aiders.

Don’t interfere with an incident, don’t go beyond your capabilities - but do be aware of basic emergencies in case you are the first person present 

 

Don’t be this dickhead:

 

 

 

[Rogerborg]

1 hour ago, steve1462 said:

I've seen some pretty bad injuries in various sites

 

What have you seen?

 

Honest question. and I'll expand on why I ask.

 

I carry the usual minor injuries kit on the car, and when doing group motorcycle rides I carry a bit more including scalpels and a set of oropharyngeal airways ever since a medical acquaintance noted that he might have been able to save a life at a crash site if he'd had those to hand.

 

For airsoft, I've pondered it, and decided not to carry anything because of the likely injuries that I can imagine.

 

Minor stuff like cuts and scrapes either don't need treated urgently, or the casualty can walk to the safe zone and use the site's kit.

 

And anything major is likely to be a limb injury, a cardiac or vascular issue, or (non traumatic) breathing problems, none of which you're going to treat with a portable kit that you happen to have on you.  A stretcher to get them off site to proper care ASAP would be what's needed there.

 

Is there anything in the middle that might benefit from a portable kit?  Deep cuts, I guess, but compression and getting to the safe zone would be my preference, rather than field treatment.  If it's that bad, then their day is probably over anyway.

[Tackle]

55 minutes ago, Tommikka said:

I don’t carry a kit when playing, but have a first aid kit in the car, and a selection in my gear.

I always have access to a selection of painkillers, plasters and/or spray/rub on ‘plaster’, anti histamine, aniseptic cream etc

 

If you have specific needs then take what’s necessary (and if you have a condition ensure the staff are aware)

 

The site should have a first aid kit with sufficient quantity and types of items suitable for the site, numbers of people etc, and first aiders.

Don’t interfere with an incident, don’t go beyond your capabilities - but do be aware of basic emergencies in case you are the first person present 

 

Don’t be this dickhead:

 

 

 

Man above is spot on, sure, carry some plasters & maybe a bandage/triangular bandage, but much more than that will become cumbersome, plus if you administer aid that your not qualified to do, you may find yourself in trouble later, such is the litigious society we live in today.

[Shamal]

What have you seen?

Ucap Liphook.

Large gentleman took a spill down a steep bank. I tried to help move him out of the deep puddle that he came to rest in but my eyeballs popped out with the strain👀!

Got on comms and called for help. He was taken off with broken ankle which was more than he came with.

Did stay with him though giving him fags and promising I would look after his fiancee 😉 lol

Regards

[Rogerborg]

1 hour ago, Tackle said:

plus if you administer aid that your not qualified to do, you may find yourself in trouble later, such is the litigious society we live in today

 

Mmm, it's a tough one.  There's no explicit duty to assist, but nor are there explicit Good Samaritan protection in any UK jurisdiction that I'm aware of.

 

The rather bizarre Social Action, Responsibility and Heroism Act 2015 just muddies the waters further.  The intentions were good, and loudly trumpeted, It's admirably terse, but the wording is rather bizarre.

 

"Social action" also covers personal assistance, so why word it as that?  And why add heroism as a separate category?  How is that different?  Does it involve personal risk?  If so, does that come with stronger protection?  If not, why list it separately?  If it does give stronger protection, is mere "social action" less protected?  Lawyers were left scratching their heads as well.

 

I strongly suspect the name was chosen just to make the bloody thing spell out SARAH (later retconned to SARHA), as the Septics love to do with their PATRIOT style bills.

 

That said, I wouldn't be too worried about it, as UK courts don't seem keen to convict public-on-public assistance.

 

What I would note is that anyone involved with the site should be clear on what their duties of care are.  See Vowles vs Evans where an amateur rugby player successfully sued an unpaid volunteer referee for a injury that they sustained due to poor refereeing decisions.

 

Do sites and their staff have a duty of care to render medical assistance?  I honestly don't know.  What I do know is that those "liability waivers" that we all sign are for novelty purposes only, as the Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977 voids them for death or injury.

[Shamal]

10 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

Mmm, it's a tough one.  There's no explicit duty to assist, but nor are there explicit Good Samaritan protection in any UK jurisdiction that I'm aware of.

 

The rather bizarre Social Action, Responsibility and Heroism Act 2015 just muddies the waters further.  The intentions were good, and loudly trumpeted, It's admirably terse, but the wording is rather bizarre.

 

"Social action" also covers personal assistance, so why word it as that?  And why add heroism as a separate category?  How is that different?  Does it involve personal risk?  If so, does that come with stronger protection?  If not, why list it separately?  If it does give stronger protection, is mere "social action" less protected?  Lawyers were left scratching their heads as well.

 

I strongly suspect the name was chosen just to make the bloody thing spell out SARAH (later retconned to SARHA), as the Septics love to do with their PATRIOT style bills.

 

That said, I wouldn't be too worried about it, as UK courts don't seem keen to convict public-on-public assistance.

 

What I would note is that anyone involved with the site should be clear on what their duties of care are.  See Vowles vs Evans where an amateur rugby player successfully sued an unpaid volunteer referee for a injury that they sustained due to poor refereeing decisions.

 

Do sites and their staff have a duty of care to render medical assistance?  I honestly don't know.  What I do know is that those "liability waivers" that we all sign are for novelty purposes only, as the Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977 voids them for death or injury.

Cripes I'm speechless!

He only asked if we carry plasters!

Epic post. I'm well impressed 👍

Wish I was clever like you. I am available for adoption! Lol

Regards 

[Tiercel]

Yes. Small molle pouch that on small regular skirmishes lives with my kit in the safe zone, and on weekenders/larger events where Im a long way from the safe zone I put it on the back of my plate carrier. Plasters and bandagers and other generic boo-boo stuff I leave to the site to carry in their own first aid kit and dont waste my time/space/weight carrying them.

 

Whats inside?

 

Trauma shears, micropore tape, sterilisation solutions, IV cannulation kit, giving sets, saline flush pods, a selection of syringes and needles, IV pain relief, a CAT torniquet, gloves and clinical wast bags, and probably most useful a foil blanket. I considered some airways but generally if Im needing them Ive got much bigger problems at hand and lets be honest Im not gonna be doing mouth to mouth on some random stranger, Ive seen the disgusting goo that comes out of people when you do that, so without a BVM theyre useless.  

 

Why do I carry all that and what the fuck am I doing with it? I'm a paramedic   Its for pain relief and stopping catastrophic bleeds when youre in the middle of some woods somewhere and popped an ankle or something out of place  or ran into a nice spikey tree branch and the ambulance is 30 mins away then gotta walk a mile into the woods carrying everything, I can at least get some good pain relief going. So unlike most ricky rescue's carrying CATs to look operator Gucci AF, I actually know what Im doing with them and not going to put them on a light graze. 

 

Overkill? Probably. Thankfully I've never had to use any of them, but I'd rather have and not need, than need and not have. Being bundled onto the back of a bumpy quadbike with a broken ankle/leg flapping around doesnt look like much fun at the best of times so at least I can try and make it more comfortable should it be needed, plus then theres IV access ready to go for the ambulance to get some stronger painkillers in right away. 

 

I also keep a selection of medications in my car for all the stuff people forget/dont plan on having at weekenders, various painkillers & anti-inflamatories for all the bumps and sprains, allergy meds, anti-diarrhoea/vomiting for the inevitable undercooked BBQ sausage, Rennies etc. Nothing worse than some unexpected toothache or weaponised shits or something ruining your weekender youve been looking forward to for months. Though those are pretty much reserved for me/my mates Im with so Im not handing out meds to random people willy-nilly. 

 

 

[Shamal]

41 minutes ago, Tiercel said:

Yes. Small molle pouch that on small regular skirmishes lives with my kit in the safe zone, and on weekenders/larger events where Im a long way from the safe zone I put it on the back of my plate carrier. Plasters and bandagers and other generic boo-boo stuff I leave to the site to carry in their own first aid kit and dont waste my time/space/weight carrying them.

 

Whats inside?

 

Trauma shears, micropore tape, sterilisation solutions, IV cannulation kit, giving sets, saline flush pods, a selection of syringes and needles, IV pain relief, a CAT torniquet, gloves and clinical wast bags, and probably most useful a foil blanket. I considered some airways but generally if Im needing them Ive got much bigger problems at hand and lets be honest Im not gonna be doing mouth to mouth on some random stranger, Ive seen the disgusting goo that comes out of people when you do that, so without a BVM theyre useless.  

 

Why do I carry all that and what the fuck am I doing with it? I'm a paramedic   Its for pain relief and stopping catastrophic bleeds when youre in the middle of some woods somewhere and popped an ankle or something out of place  or ran into a nice spikey tree branch and the ambulance is 30 mins away then gotta walk a mile into the woods carrying everything, I can at least get some good pain relief going. So unlike most ricky rescue's carrying CATs to look operator Gucci AF, I actually know what Im doing with them and not going to put them on a light graze. 

 

Overkill? Probably. Thankfully I've never had to use any of them, but I'd rather have and not need, than need and not have. Being bundled onto the back of a bumpy quadbike with a broken ankle/leg flapping around doesnt look like much fun at the best of times so at least I can try and make it more comfortable should it be needed, plus then theres IV access ready to go for the ambulance to get some stronger painkillers in right away. 

 

I also keep a selection of medications in my car for all the stuff people forget/dont plan on having at weekenders, various painkillers & anti-inflamatories for all the bumps and sprains, allergy meds, anti-diarrhoea/vomiting for the inevitable undercooked BBQ sausage, Rennies etc. Nothing worse than some unexpected toothache or weaponised shits or something ruining your weekender youve been looking forward to for months. Though those are pretty much reserved for me/my mates Im with so Im not handing out meds to random people willy-nilly. 

 

Kudos to you. Please follow me around the sites that I attend.

Gratitude to you!

Regards 

[Albiscuit]

I carry as little around with me as possible as personally I think it’s pointless having one with you in the field. Where do you draw the line at things you might need? 

A decent site will have marshals who are first aid trained and (one would think) a kit out in the field or easily got to in the safe zone. I have seen some bad injuries on site too and they have always been dealt with in a professional manner and I don’t think a lack of personal first aid kit made any difference to either situation.

 

I do have one in the boot of the car anyway as I have kids and do outdoor activities and it’s useful having plasters, wipes, paracetamol etc near to hand when I’m out.  

but... each to their own. If you want another pouch with more gear then crack on. I’m sure one day it might come in handy and you can say I told you so   

 

btw I only skirmish, a milsim or long game day, no safe zone type game is a different matter

@Rogerborg I reread the OPs post and Had the same thought as you “what have you seen that a medikit could help with”  and again “why would you be the one to step up” most “bad” injuries tend to be ankles/knees twisting or popping (one marshal went to a downed player and commented his knee pad had slipped behind his leg, only to realise it was a knee cap.

A player running over with a pouch of plasters is no use in that situation.

 

fir enough @Tiercel carry’s a lot of gear (and my first thought was why the heck) but seeing they are a paramedic makes sense. I wouldn’t really appreciate any player other than one saying they were a medical professional trying to help or administer aid to me over a marshal and even though I aim first aid trained myself I would be VERY reluctant do more than check an injured player is comfortable and call a marshal

[Cyberlawyer]

I do carry a first aid kit on my belt kit at all times. It’s on one of those tear off pouches clearly marked as a medical kit.

 

When I packed mine my thinking was three fold. Firstly what level of kit am I adequately trained and would be comfortable using in an emergency. Secondly what level of kit would I be happy with some random Good Samaritan using on me if I was the casualty and they were using my kit on me. Thirdly what am I likely to use frequently for myself (I.e, painkillers, minor bumps & grazes & blister kit)

 

As a result of the second consideration I took stuff out of my belt IFAC. While my training is well short of paramedic level it’s decently beyond what a regular works first aider gets, but I would not want some random but well intentioned first aider trying some of that stuff on me so I don’t consider it appropriate to carry or to attempt in a first aid situation where I am acting as a private citizen rescuer (for all of the legal reasons set out above).

[Shamal]

2 hours ago, Albiscuit said:

I carry as little around with me as possible as personally I think it’s pointless having one with you in the field. Where do you draw the line at things you might need? 

A decent site will have marshals who are first aid trained and (one would think) a kit out in the field or easily got to in the safe zone. I have seen some bad injuries on site too and they have always been dealt with in a professional manner and I don’t think a lack of personal first aid kit made any difference to either situation.

 

I do have one in the boot of the car anyway as I have kids and do outdoor activities and it’s useful having plasters, wipes, paracetamol etc near to hand when I’m out.  

but... each to their own. If you want another pouch with more gear then crack on. I’m sure one day it might come in handy and you can say I told you so   

 

btw I only skirmish, a milsim or long game day, no safe zone type game is a different matter

@Rogerborg I reread the OPs post and Had the same thought as you “what have you seen that a medikit could help with”  and again “why would you be the one to step up” most “bad” injuries tend to be ankles/knees twisting or popping (one marshal went to a downed player and commented his knee pad had slipped behind his leg, only to realise it was a knee cap.

A player running over with a pouch of plasters is no use in that situation.

 

fir enough @Tiercel carry’s a lot of gear (and my first thought was why the heck) but seeing they are a paramedic makes sense. I wouldn’t really appreciate any player other than one saying they were a medical professional trying to help or administer aid to me over a marshal and even though I aim first aid trained myself I would be VERY reluctant do more than check an injured player is comfortable and call a marshal

Take what you are saying. 

I have played the nae for four consecutive years and my kit has come in useful on two occasions. The nae is a huge site and you can be very alone. Underfoot is hard to traverse in places and dense Bush  can cause rips and cuts. Not life threatening but a handy plaster and antiseptic wipe can help.

Not Dr Kildare I admit but it's something

Regards 

40 minutes ago, Cyberlawyer said:

I do carry a first aid kit on my belt kit at all times. It’s on one of those tear off pouches clearly marked as a medical kit.

 

When I packed mine my thinking was three fold. Firstly what level of kit am I adequately trained and would be comfortable using in an emergency. Secondly what level of kit would I be happy with some random Good Samaritan using on me if I was the casualty and they were using my kit on me. Thirdly what am I likely to use frequently for myself (I.e, painkillers, minor bumps & grazes & blister kit)

 

As a result of the second consideration I took stuff out of my belt IFAC. While my training is well short of paramedic level it’s decently beyond what a regular works first aider gets, but I would not want some random but well intentioned first aider trying some of that stuff on me so I don’t consider it appropriate to carry or to attempt in a first aid situation where I am acting as a private citizen rescuer (for all of the legal reasons set out above).

Damn.hope I'm not put on your team! Lol

[Rogerborg]

2 hours ago, Shamal said:

The nae is a huge site and you can be very alone.

 

Mmm, good point, and for extended milsims too it might be different.  I'm thinking more of regular skirmishes where you're never too far from a safe zone in daylight.

 

Oh, I always (as in, always) carry aspirin with me, and you should too.

[Tackle]

10 hours ago, Rogerborg said:

 

Mmm, it's a tough one.  There's no explicit duty to assist, but nor are there explicit Good Samaritan protection in any UK jurisdiction that I'm aware of.

 

The rather bizarre Social Action, Responsibility and Heroism Act 2015 just muddies the waters further.  The intentions were good, and loudly trumpeted, It's admirably terse, but the wording is rather bizarre.

 

"Social action" also covers personal assistance, so why word it as that?  And why add heroism as a separate category?  How is that different?  Does it involve personal risk?  If so, does that come with stronger protection?  If not, why list it separately?  If it does give stronger protection, is mere "social action" less protected?  Lawyers were left scratching their heads as well.

 

I strongly suspect the name was chosen just to make the bloody thing spell out SARAH (later retconned to SARHA), as the Septics love to do with their PATRIOT style bills.

 

That said, I wouldn't be too worried about it, as UK courts don't seem keen to convict public-on-public assistance.

 

What I would note is that anyone involved with the site should be clear on what their duties of care are.  See Vowles vs Evans where an amateur rugby player successfully sued an unpaid volunteer referee for a injury that they sustained due to poor refereeing decisions.

 

Do sites and their staff have a duty of care to render medical assistance?  I honestly don't know.  What I do know is that those "liability waivers" that we all sign are for novelty purposes only, as the Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977 voids them for death or injury.

To be honest I've been a first aider for many years, legitimately from when joining the army, but even before that trained in cpr/wound management etc in my early teens as a cadet, & I don't think there's ever been a time when I've rendered assistance that I've thought "am I right in doing this", it's the sort of thing you just jump straight in, BUT the last few times I've done refreshers just to "renew my ticket", essentially for workplace insurance etc, the testers have made a point about a few documented cases where first aiders who have allowed their paperwork to lapse, rendered incorrect aid & then found themselves sued (& subsequently weren't insured), one example was somebody mistakenly administering cpr on someone who WASNT having a heart attack, & broke his sternum.

thankfully most airsoft related injuries tend to be cuts, bruises, chipped teeth & the occasional broken bone.

With regards to what to carry, if it needs more than plasters etc, best it be referred professionals such as @Tiercel (much respect mate👍), ideally when they're on duty & getting paid to fix up dopey overgrown kids that keep falling over 😂.

And if all else fails, sometimes you have to improvise, prob the worst thing I ever dealt with was when a comrade was shot on a training exercise, massive wound in his shoulder & when I got to him lads were trying to get a dressing on it, but the sheer size & depth meant the dressing pad couldn't get any pressure in the wound, plus no tourniquet options so there was a good chance he could bleed out, easiest solution I could come up with was to remove my cap badge, roll my beret up tight & use it to pack the wound, not the prettiest job but it bought us the time to get him to safety.

never did get my beret back lol

[FreeFrag.UK]

I carry a basic boo-boo kit as I'm on anti-coagulant med's along with a variety of others medications. I don't see any point in carrying stuff you don't know how to use as you're only risking further damage. Admittedly I would like to pursue more in-depth and formally recognised first aid training, especially given my other hobbies, but at the moment it is on hold.

 

There's a great example on Angry Cop's YouTube channel of some muppet not only failing to apply a tourniquet but also trying to use one where it simply isn't needed by any stretch of the imagination.

 

 

[Albiscuit]

@Shamal I understand a large game like that, even touched in that in my first post. That makes sense. But for a typical Sunday skirmish I personally don’t see the point in carrying more than you need.

[Rogerborg]

1 hour ago, FreeFrag.UK said:

I don't see any point in carrying stuff you don't know how to use as you're only risking further damage.

 

Someone there might know how to use it, and be glad it's there.

 

However, it's situational, and only applies to equipment that you're likely to need in the first place.

[FreeFrag.UK]

40 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

Someone there might know how to use it, and be glad it's there.

 

 

Definitely a fair point.

[heroshark]

I once kept a a hello kitty plaster in my admin for about a year in the hope someone asked me for a plaster. Never happened 😢 .

[timski]

The sites I play at know of my job so I’ll leave more advanced kit in the safe zone with them and have coms on me incase (Had to be used last year for a diabetic incident)

but will always say to carry a small basic first aid kit incase you pic a fight with brambles or decide to burn yourself with a smoke grenade, we’ve all been there.

[Shamal]

On 24/08/2020 at 00:38, Rogerborg said:

 

Mmm, good point, and for extended milsims too it might be different.  I'm thinking more of regular skirmishes where you're never too far from a safe zone in daylight.

 

Oh, I always (as in, always) carry aspirin with me, and you should too.

Certainly do.im on them anyway 

[MadMole]

I carry a basic kit, plus eye wash and sutures. lots of triangulars and airways. But I used to be a paramedic so folks kind of expect it of me

[Sneaky]

I don’t carry a first aid kit, just a pouch of Maryland cookies....

[Rogerborg]

2 minutes ago, Damion said:

I don’t carry a first aid kit, just a pouch of Maryland cookies....