Paintballer coming over from the dark side... help is appreciated!

[Ryfoolz]

Hey Guys, after too many weekends of long days in the cold and wet and just the general free for all shambles that is paintball me and a friend have decided to sell our paintball markers and start to airsoft instead!

After hours of looking at guns and getting hands on with them at shops im still having issues with what im wanting from a gun. My friend has settled on going GBB and is happy with his choice where as i would prefer to go down the electric route. I really enjoyed playing with the TM recoil series guns and found the kick quite fun but seeing as im playing mainly cqb i dont know if an EVO/Vector would be a smarter purchase.

 

Does anyone have any experience of any SMGS with electric blowback? (if those are a thing) and what would persuade you to get a evo/vector over any of the TM recoil series (HK416, M4, SCAR ect)

 

Any help is appreciated!

 

Ryfoolz

[Dentonboy]

The only AEG I would ever buy over a TM Recoil (or a TM in general) would be an ASG EVO Scorpion.

 

If you are mainly playing indoor CQB, then a small gas SMG may be more to your liking - ASG's MP9, TM's MP7 or WE's MP5 are seemingly good options from what I have seen/read.

 

A TM shotgun; the electric AA12 or gas M870 series may be worth looking into.

 

My general rule of thumb is 'buy TM.'

[EvilMonkee]

TM Recoils are usually the bench mark for recoil M4 based shenanigans.  I personally think they are overpriced for what they deliver and am a strong advocate for the KWA ERG series which were designed by the same person and recoil harder, are easier to work on and about £150 cheaper.

 

Can firmly recommend the TM GBB MP7 though.  

 

All in all, despite what people say, there really isn't much difference in stock guns.  Buy a decent brand at the price point good for you and in an aesthetic you like.  

 

Vector or EVO are both good choices for an SMG.  

[Druid799]

Freely confess I’m an out and out TM recoil fanboy and I detest Evo’s to the very pit of my arse ! But if your going to be playing predominantly CQB then I’d say a TM would be a perfect choice . Get a deans on it so you can run a LiPo and it’ll last all day plus as the FPS is quite a bit lower compared to a lot of other guns ‘out of the box’ then it’s already at an ideal CQB FPS so you don’t have to piss about with your gun to get it it running at a site friendly power level ? Get a 416 or a CQB-R and you’ve a perfect length gun for it . When you come down to it what would you rather , running around with a couple of hi-caps blasting away till the sun goes down OR blasting away and then having to do a mag change mid fire fight because your out and your guns stopped working so you need a reload ? I know which one I prefer and it don’t involve any ‘combat maracas’ that’s for certain ! 👍

😂😂😂😂

[Musica]

43 minutes ago, Druid799 said:

Freely confess I’m an out and out TM recoil fanboy and I detest Evo’s to the very pit of my arse ! But if your going to be playing predominantly CQB then I’d say a TM would be a perfect choice . Get a deans on it so you can run a LiPo and it’ll last all day plus as the FPS is quite a bit lower compared to a lot of other guns ‘out of the box’ then it’s already at an ideal CQB FPS so you don’t have to piss about with your gun to get it it running at a site friendly power level ? Get a 416 or a CQB-R and you’ve a perfect length gun for it . When you come down to it what would you rather , running around with a couple of hi-caps blasting away till the sun goes down OR blasting away and then having to do a mag change mid fire fight because your out and your guns stopped working so you need a reload ? I know which one I prefer and it don’t involve any ‘combat maracas’ that’s for certain ! 👍

😂😂😂😂

Why don't you like the evo mate?

 

I have the same dilemma as yourself. If I was to buy a TM Recoil I'd be tempted to pay for some upgrades out of the box like AOE correction and  Deans wired. Below is my short list of guns I am considering. TM isn't on the list because they are very expensive and I can't justify the cost. 

 

 

 

PTS Centurion Arms CM4 C4-10 ERG

KWA Ronin 6 PDW

KWA TK.45c

ASG SCORPION EVO 2018 revision

VFC mp7 aeg ( not out yet) 

[Wo1f]

Out of those in the list I’d take the PTS, but for that price I’m sure you can get an m4 recoil. Won’t look as pretty, but that’s what I’d go with.

 

Had a scorpion for a week and it was crap. The VFC mp7 looks promising for an AEG, but I’ve no idea how much they are. The best mp7 is the TM gbbr

[BigStew]

another TM  fanboy here just got an MP7 GBB and loving it i'm very fond of my AA-12 and really miss having an H Scar. other than deans connectors you do not need to doing anything to a TM they just work and you can spend a lot of time and money getting not much more performance.  

[Ryfoolz]

Thanks for all the replies guys its definitely helped me narrow down what ill look for! I never imagined there would be soo much choice for a great quality equipment! Im fortunate that i dont really have a budget so i can just buy what takes my fancy, although i would prefer to buy once and not spend half my spare time tinkering with it Ive heard gbb's dont perform too well in the cold though, is that a common issue in the smgs aswell? i imagine its a case of making sure the mags arnt completely frozen? Its difficult because i really want the feel on a gbb but ideally in smg/small rifle config, i think the HK16 (and any alternatives such as the KWA) might be the best way to go! Also after not being able to use optics and attachments the 12 year old inside me is screaming to bolt everything i can onto the gun

 

 

[BigStew]

16 minutes ago, Ryfoolz said:

Thanks for all the replies guys its definitely helped me narrow down what ill look for! I never imagined there would be soo much choice for a great quality equipment! Im fortunate that i dont really have a budget so i can just buy what takes my fancy, although i would prefer to buy once and not spend half my spare time tinkering with it Ive heard gbb's dont perform too well in the cold though, is that a common issue in the smgs aswell? i imagine its a case of making sure the mags arnt completely frozen? Its difficult because i really want the feel on a gbb but ideally in smg/small rifle config, i think the HK16 (and any alternatives such as the KWA) might be the best way to go! Also after not being able to use optics and attachments the 12 year old inside me is screaming to bolt everything i can onto the gun

 

 

don't discount second hand if you go TM 2nd hand just make sure its stock.

[Dentonboy]

I think the MP9 works well in colder times. I saw two being used last November and both didn't miss a beat outside.

[EvilMonkee]

Yeh GBB cool down is a thing.  My TM MP7 GBB worked really well even when it was cold.  TBH if money is no object, buy a TM Recoil (even though I am not a fan) from Fire Support and get them to upgrade it.  Done.

[Dentonboy]

TM Recoil with Dean's modification and a couple of lipo's, a nice TM GBB pistol and a back up TM MP7 GBB SMG and you've got yourself a fun party!

[Druid799]

 

3 hours ago, Musica said:

Why don't you like the evo mate?

 

I have the same dilemma as yourself. If I was to buy a TM Recoil I'd be tempted to pay for some upgrades out of the box like AOE correction and  Deans wired. Below is my short list of guns I am considering. TM isn't on the list because they are very expensive and I can't justify the cost. 

 

 

 

PTS Centurion Arms CM4 C4-10 ERG

KWA Ronin 6 PDW

KWA TK.45c

ASG SCORPION EVO 2018 revision

VFC mp7 aeg ( not out yet) 

Don’t like the look of Evo’s and one thing I’ve been convinced of my whole life is no matter how good somthing is if you don’t like the look of it from the start then you’ll never get its full potential .

up-grading TM recoils ? Now this is just my own thoughts on it BUT apart from sticking a deans on it if anyone tells you that you need to upgrade XY&Z on it then there talking out of there arse , you don’t NEED to upgrade anything on them at all you go on any forum/Facebook group/or what ever and you will see literally hundreds say “oh this will go and that will go so you need to replace this and you need to replace !” Sorry but bollox you need to replace anything in it , you may want too but you certainly don’t need too . And I’ll guarantee you you’ll see exactly the same players popping up constantly asking for advice as they got this problem or that problem with there upgraded guns !🤦‍♂️ 

Japan has very strict FPS laws so TM build there guns to the perfect tolerances for that market , once you start messing about with them your on a fast train to shitsville , and I can say this with conviction from personal experience . I’ve currently got 5 recoils and I have had 11 in total over the past 10-11yrs ? And I’ve still got my very first one I had a socom and guess what apart from a deans it’s still stock and out of the 11 I’ve owned the only two that have died we’re both upgraded , one by a friend and the other by a well known shop mentioned earlier in this thread . AND the same goes for my team mates who also have recoils , only problems any have had have been with upgraded ones . Says it all really wouldn’t you say ? 😉

[Musica]

16 minutes ago, Druid799 said:

 

Don’t like the look of Evo’s and one thing I’ve been convinced of my whole life is no matter how good somthing is if you don’t like the look of it from the start then you’ll never get its full potential .

up-grading TM recoils ? Now this is just my own thoughts on it BUT apart from sticking a deans on it if anyone tells you that you need to upgrade XY&Z on it then there talking out of there arse , you don’t NEED to upgrade anything on them at all you go on any forum/Facebook group/or what ever and you will see literally hundreds say “oh this will go and that will go so you need to replace this and you need to replace !” Sorry but bollox you need to replace anything in it , you may want too but you certainly don’t need too . And I’ll guarantee you you’ll see exactly the same players popping up constantly asking for advice as they got this problem or that problem with there upgraded guns !🤦‍♂️ 

Japan has very strict FPS laws so TM build there guns to the perfect tolerances for that market , once you start messing about with them your on a fast train to shitsville , and I can say this with conviction from personal experience . I’ve currently got 5 recoils and I have had 11 in total over the past 10-11yrs ? And I’ve still got my very first one I had a socom and guess what apart from a deans it’s still stock and out of the 11 I’ve owned the only two that have died we’re both upgraded , one by a friend and the other by a well known shop mentioned earlier in this thread . AND the same goes for my team mates who also have recoils , only problems any have had have been with upgraded ones . Says it all really wouldn’t you say ? 😉

Good to know it was aesthetics that put you off the evo. Mag capacity is holding me back from committing to it.

 

I only suggested AOE correction for a TM to make it last EVEN longer but I agree it's built to run stock and will run stock great.  I am very new to the hobby and could be talking out my arse. I haven't seen what works what doesn't and every youtube who gets a TM always drops almost as much as the gun in upgrades in it immediately. I start to wonder why as if your upgrading almost everything why pay for high spec stock components in the first place. Probably some conspiracy with the techs who give them the free upgrades to attract business or something. I can't tell which youtubers are shills yet.  

 

Anyhow back on topic. If your looking for a  AEG SMG and have money to burn you can buy an evo and a manufacture upgrade package which included warranty. https://jdairsoft.net/evotek-evo-3-a1-expert-upgrade-package 

 

Then run it on 11.1v batteries . Another plus is if you haven't got UKARA you can buy two tone evos and later on buy the parts in black and replace them. (im sure other guns work this way but other that pistol slides I haven't seen much like this) https://www.patrolbase.co.uk/asg-cz-scorpion-evo-body-kit?pv=7162

 

But if you don't like the look of the evo you can maybe fix that with an m4 stock https://www.patrolbase.co.uk/asg-scorpion-evo-cnc-buffer-tube-stock-adaptor and a new front end?   https://www.patrolbase.co.uk/hb-industries-cz-scorpion-evo-3-mlok-handguard 

 

Can't think of a better performing SMG AEG myself. Some cons. Full plastic body (which is exactly like the real steel), 75 round magazines. Battery compartment is hated for being fiddly. requires an adapter to use 14mm muzzle devices. I have read anecdotal reports of the stock gears being made of "dog shit" but I'm not sure how many of these people left stock gears to run an upgraded spring or motor or something. 

[Druid799]

Again that Evo ‘expert-upgrade’ (expert upgrade what’s that all about? Do they also offer a ‘new guy hasn’t a fucking clue upgrade package’ for £17.46? 😳) same thing , I don’t get why you choose to buy an accepted hi-end gun then spend a shit load more on ‘upgrading’ it before you’ve even pulled the bloody trigger because someone’s brothers girlfriends aunties cousins dog walkers son says you should ! WHY ! 🤦‍♂️

I’m a great believer that a LOT of stuff in Airsofting is all very Emperor’s new clothes , you’ll get a player (more than likely some YouTube spunktrumpet) will say they did this and that and now there gun can shoot round corners and never misses and before you know it all the fanboys are gibbering on about it and you MUST do it or your gun is a piece of crap and everyone will point and laugh at you ! And loads get sucked in by the whole thing . Just my opinion , and like I frequently say “opinions are like arseholes , and everyone has one !” 😉

[Dentonboy]

I read great things about the Evo.

 

Almost bought one over Christmas.

 

Brother bought one last week. I watched it in action. I now believe. The thing is incredibly good and my very hard to please brother is loving it.

[Wo1f]

40 minutes ago, Dentonboy said:

I read great things about the Evo.

 

Almost bought one over Christmas.

 

Brother bought one last week. I watched it in action. I now believe. The thing is incredibly good and my very hard to please brother is loving it.

They eat gears, so bare that in mind in the future

[Musica]

20 minutes ago, Wo1f said:

They eat gears, so bare that in mind in the future

I have read people saying similar but asg do offer a warranty or grab the cheaper upgrade which upgrades the gears https://jdairsoft.net/evotech-evo-3-a1-professional-upgrade-package 

 

I have heard warranty can be spotty now but no experience of the gears or warranty to speak about it with authority.

[Wo1f]

1 minute ago, Musica said:

I have read people saying similar but asg do offer a warranty or grab the cheaper upgrade which upgrades the gears https://jdairsoft.net/evotech-evo-3-a1-professional-upgrade-package 

 

I have heard warranty can be spotty now but no experience of the gears or warranty to speak about it with authority.

Having observed ASG on the web and social media, I wouldn’t be too confident. Defends their grenade after cracking from a few throws and deletes any negative comments 

[_stylian_]

Hace you thought about HPA? You'll already have the bottles and potentially the lines from your markers

[Tommikka]

4 hours ago, _stylian_ said:

Hace you thought about HPA? You'll already have the bottles and potentially the lines from your markers

It might be an obvious idea with him coming from paintball.

But going from paintball HPA to airsoft HPA comes the issue of output pressures.  A typical paintball cylinder outputs somewhere around 600psi (But could be unto 850psi which was the original paintball output to align with the CO2 it replaced) 

Mechanical paintball guns tend to work with that high pressure, electronic ones have inline regulators bringing it down to about 200psi.

 

Going to airsoft HPA still brings the need of the more expensive parts of the airsoft transposition.

Its also likely that he has full size paintball cylinders, so for the convenience if going to HPA  @Ryfoolz may need to buy a 13ci cylinder*.  He's shown an interest in SMGs and CQB, so putting on anything but a 13ci in a stock means added bulk and a remote line to tangle up.

 

*Not everyone has about 5 or 6 cylinders of different shapes sizes & weights in the cupboard like me, not counting my out of date collection!

[_stylian_]

Depends on the player. I found it way easier to move over (after trying and hating AEG rifles), but I already used air tanks with remote line, and Tippmanns need no secondary reg

[Ryfoolz]

On 26/01/2019 at 07:59, _stylian_ said:

Hace you thought about HPA? You'll already have the bottles and potentially the lines from your markers

 

I did give it some thought but having used remote lines a few times before i just decided it wasnt for me, i much prefered running about with something completely disconnected! Used a rental G36C last night for the first time and really enjoyed the platform, this just makes the choice harder than it bloody should be!