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swingledingle

Re-spraying my gun now I have my UKARA?

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Hello everyone! 

 

So I now have my UKARA! Andddd... was wondering if I can re spray my two tone weapon now to make it no longer two tone! 

 

The guy at the shop said it was a major grey area and couldn’t really give me a straight answer. 

 

I just want the go ahead before I spray it and then risk (low risk lol) of getting into trouble.

 

thanks 🤗

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Yes you can spray it. There isn't any grey area about it, it has to be two tone at time of sale, and you have a defence, so there's no real risk of getting into trouble. Unless you try and hold up the local post office with it, but that's another matter.😂

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It falls under "manufacturing" a RIF, by making a 2 tone Imitation Firearm no longer 2 tone, you are making a Realistic Imitation Firearm.

 

The odds of prosecution after the fact however are slim (but not none), as owning a RIF itself is not illegal and as a skirmisher with UKARA registration, as long as you're being a sensible airsofter and not doing silly things you are unlikely to ever even be asked if it has been 'de-toned'.

 

tl;dr : it's not a grey area it is in breach of law, however as an airsofter you're unlikely to face criminal proceedings.

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I was under the impression - as long as you had the appropriate defense, it was OK to respray 

 

The way I understood it, if you have a two tone, once you have a defense, you can then buy different parts (i.e a new receiver) in black/tan etc and change it out. So why wouldnt that be the same for painting it.

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I'm not going to say do or don't (lil' disclaimer) but I will say with the exception of this thread; who would know?

 

I have never ever heard of anyone in the entire universe have a Copper investigate the paintwork of a RIF...

 

I think if you got stopped, the shape and form of it would be more of interest than the colour and if you have a UKARA plus a site membership then you're allowed to own it.

 

I'm curious as to where manufacturing starts and finishes, I mean looking at 99% of members treasured m4s for example. Most are not as they were manufactured; many have RS furniture, m-lok this and that, new internals etc. Surely this is manufacturing more so than a paintjob?

 

Just curious like I said... doing away with a little red or blue paint seems like nothing in comparison to what we can do.

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1 hour ago, skintrade said:

It falls under "manufacturing" a RIF,

 

<triggered> A person is guilty of an offence if he modifies an imitation firearm so that it becomes a realistic imitation firearm; </triggered>

 

If you're a reasonable airsoft skirmisher, the chances of you being convicted of this offence are so low that no reasonable person should be concerned about  it.

 

And that's before you got a UKARA number.

 

As I've noted multiple times (plus one more now), the real practical risk to carrying a RIF or an IF is the Firearms Act 1968 S19 offence of having it in a public place.  Because why?  Because that's when a copper might take an interest. If they do, you've got to produce a reasonable excuse to the FA offence (i.e. that you're on your way to or from a skirmish).  If you can't do so, woe unto you.  If you can do so, well, there's your defence to modifying it as well.

 

tl;dr version - if you're not worried about taking your IF to or from a game day, you shouldn't be worried about modifying it into a RIF.

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Thanks a lot everyone! Off with the red it is then! 

 

Anyone could tell me what sort of paint would be good to use? And maybe what colour would be best? I’ve got a SIG 552 and it’s non two tone parts seem like a dark drey rather than a black. 

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23 minutes ago, swingledingle said:

Thanks a lot everyone! Off with the red it is then! 

 

Anyone could tell me what sort of paint would be good to use? And maybe what colour would be best? I’ve got a SIG 552 and it’s non two tone parts seem like a dark drey rather than a black. 

 

In my experience Krylon is a pretty good product to use. There's plenty of videos online with tutorials on the best methods to paint your gun.

 

You'll want to prep the gun - making sure there's no dust or dirt on it and clear out space for you to paint in with good ventilation. Tape up the important parts and spray some primer on it if you fancy, or just go straight in with paint. Light coats work best at about half a meter. Spray a layer, leave it 10 minutes and come back to rinse and repeat. With Kyrlon the drying time should be pretty quick but once you're done I suggest leaving it a few hours just in case. Nothing worse than finishing your paint job and getting a nice big fingerprint on it!

 

I like black or black/tan guns personally, but go with whatever you like the look of best.

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23 minutes ago, swingledingle said:

Thanks a lot everyone! Off with the red it is then! 

 

Anyone could tell me what sort of paint would be good to use? And maybe what colour would be best? I’ve got a SIG 552 and it’s non two tone parts seem like a dark drey rather than a black. 

 

I used Halfords mat black, with Halfords grey undercoat on all my guns. Dust it on a tiny bit at a time

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Depending on whether you just want to go to original colours, I would consider if the paint added by PB can be removed easily. Depending on how long he paint has been on, where it is, and if plastic or metal parts, it may be easy to restore to factory with minimal effort. Worst case you end up painting it anyway.

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1 hour ago, rocketdogbert said:

 

I used Halfords mat black, with Halfords grey undercoat on all my guns. Dust it on a tiny bit at a time

Yeh the Halfords cammo spray is good. Comes in black, brown and yes, brown. Ultra matt finish and hard wearing.

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2 hours ago, E21A said:

Technically it falls under manufacturing, however, no is really going to care or even know.... unless you post about it on a public forum of course 😉😂

I’m sure you’ll all keep a secret for me 😂

16 minutes ago, YorkieT17 said:

!Sig Green!

 

or black (and boring)

Had a look at the green and it looks real nice! Might add my own twist to it! Once it’s all done I’ll put a pic up! 

 

Big thanks to everyone who commented! 🤗

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I'm sure you'll be fine unless Swingledingle is on your driving license / passport / birth certificate

3 minutes ago, swingledingle said:

I’m sure you’ll all keep a secret for me 😂

 

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I think it’s very much like the situation with baofeng radios , you should have a licence to use the frequency they run on but most don’t have one they just take the chance and run them . Or so I’ve heard cough ! cough ! 😉

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1 hour ago, swingledingle said:

I’m sure you’ll all keep a secret for me 😂 

Keeping secrets from the law!!?? 😱 

1 hour ago, skintrade said:

I'm sure you'll be fine unless Swingledingle is on your driving license / passport / birth certificate

 

Could you imagine the conversation though

"Officer, Officer! I want to report someone online for manufacturing a RIF!! Their name is swingledingle and, and... They hung up on me..."

 

😂😂

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2 hours ago, LightningCh said:

Keeping secrets from the law!!?? 😱 

Could you imagine the conversation though

"Officer, Officer! I want to report someone online for manufacturing a RIF!! Their name is swingledingle and, and... They hung up on me..."

 

😂😂

😂😂 thank god for my choice of username! 

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12 hours ago, E21A said:

Technically it falls under manufacturing

 

You are technically incorrect.

 

The worst kind of incorrect.

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Painting an IF into a RIF often gets referred to as potentially manufacturing a RIF as it falls within the paragraph headed “Manufacture import & sale” but has its own specific line with “modify” which would include painting an IF made with brightly coloured plastic or removing the paint of a RIF that had been rendered two tone by the retailer.

Section 36 is followed by the defences in section 37.  Therefore it’s quite clear cut that a UKARA registered player has a valid defence to turn their preUKARA IF into a RIF for them to continue to play at insured sites etc 

 

My memory of the original bill was that repainting / modifying an IF into a RIF was a specific offence and the defences applied to manufacture/imports/sales/purchases didn’t apply.  I will sometimes refer to that before double checking and find myself to now be wrong.  I may just be wrong or the offence paragraph moved at some point from bill to act or a subsequent amendment.

Theres also a reference to painting in the FAQs from this forum, so I’m going to assume that I was right and the legislation has changed .... or it depends on circumstances 

 

It can be called a grey area either for that  same reason, or that the person saying so doesn’t want any responsibility for the advice they give.

There is a line of responsibility that moves depending on which offence under the act.

Retailers are responsible at the point of sale,  not the buyer, hence the UKARA process to document reasonable checks on the buyers intent.  There is no comeback on the player (unless they are up to something that results in confiscation and other offences)

Modifying / painting is typically conducted by the player and the fines are their repsonsibility.

 

UKARA is only a scheme and not a legal requirement, therefore to the letter of the law it would be legal for a player to buy an IF and to modify it on receipt provided that is for the purpose of skirmishing on genuine sites with the appropriate insurance etc in place.

Very few people are going to say that is OK as they have no idea what the real intent is and whether a court would stick purely to that.

 

Courts tend to stick to the letter of the law, but a judge can interpret the intent of the legislation, both prosecuting and defending lawyers will also interpret and present their cases as to whether circumstances apply or not.

 

 

As the OP is now registered with the UKARA, if they intend to continue to play at proper sites and don’t act like a dick then there won’t be a need to take it to court to decide 

 

 

 

36Manufacture, import and sale of realistic imitation firearms

(1)A person is guilty of an offence if—

(a)he manufactures a realistic imitation firearm;

(b)he modifies an imitation firearm so that it becomes a realistic imitation firearm;

(c)he sells a realistic imitation firearm; or

(d)he brings a realistic imitation firearm into Great Britain or causes one to be brought into Great Britain.

(2)Subsection (1) has effect subject to the defences in section 37.

 

 

 

 

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