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Overpriced clothing

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Can someone explain why companies want this sort of money for what is essentially a UBACS that can be had for about a tenner? 

Whats so special about this? (And other stuff like it) 

 

 

02B6EAEB-B4F9-47FB-BB53-67C0A3260EBA.png

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4 minutes ago, E21A said:

Can someone explain why companies want this sort of money for what is essentially a UBACS that can be had for about a tenner? 

Whats so special about this? (And other stuff like it) 

 

 

02B6EAEB-B4F9-47FB-BB53-67C0A3260EBA.png

Because someone will pay

Noting of course that a UBACS for £10 will be second hand issued for free to the person who sells it on (or gives it away to someone who sells it on).   Alternarively it has come out of the back door of the QMs

Surplus kit though is sold in bulk by weight, so the army surplus shop etc taking get a random assortment in a box

 

New goods though are made by someone in a quantity and quality that they think they can sell at a profit 

 

Don’t want to pay the price, don’t buy it

 

 

 

 

 

 

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5 minutes ago, Tommikka said:

 

Don’t want to pay the price, don’t buy it

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

OMG WOW .... where would we be without you Captain Obvious? 🤣

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its because they can get away with chancing it, to the completely uninitiated it probably looks reasonable.

 

i tend to stick to milsurp myself, cheap and decent, plus flecktarn is easy had and basically godmode.

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20 minutes ago, Tommikka said:

Because someone will pay

Noting of course that a UBACS for £10 will be second hand issued for free to the person who sells it on (or gives it away to someone who sells it on).   Alternarively it has come out of the back door of the QMs

Surplus kit though is sold in bulk by weight, so the army surplus shop etc taking get a random assortment in a box

 

New goods though are made by someone in a quantity and quality that they think they can sell at a profit 

 

Don’t want to pay the price, don’t buy it

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks for not answering the question Captin Butthurt 😉😂

11 minutes ago, Adolf Hamster said:

its because they can get away with chancing it, to the completely uninitiated it probably looks reasonable.

 

i tend to stick to milsurp myself, cheap and decent, plus flecktarn is easy had and basically godmode.

 

Same. I just don’t get what they use to justify the cost? 

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My take, owned some clawgear kit, smocks are dear but awesome quality, off the back of the super high quality (& reputation) of some of their stuff, they'll price everything else accordingly, but its no different to most other big name manufacturers, they'll all do it, & why not, as long as theres geardo's out there silly enough to jizz over every bit of kit that they put their name to.

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1 hour ago, E21A said:

 

 

Thanks for not answering the question Captin Butthurt 😉😂

 

Same. I just don’t get what they use to justify the cost? 

I answered the first question

 

 

For the second question, Clawgear make lots of claims about the premium materials, fire retarding etc and all the usual ‘developed with a special forces unit’

If genuine multicam pattern then they also have a licence fee (and they are calling it multicam so they should be, unlike Hong Kong & China who don’t care)

That accounts for it costing more than a second hand item which costs the MoD more again

But the real answer is my first one, they will charge what people will pay

 

We can equally buy a cheap t shirt for a couple of pounds, ten, more or a stupid amount 

 

 

 

 

 

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I used to own Emerson/China gear and now run clawgear clothing (that shirt) and operator pants. 

 

The quality is night and day from the clone stuff. They are genuine multi cam, and they are issued to some militaries apparently. The shirt is great. The body material is nice and light. It breathes really well and is soft, so it doesn’t sand your nipples off with a plate carrier after you’ve been sweating lol. The arms are light, but seem very resistant to cuts, offering good protection. The stitching is far superior to anything China made. 

 

I have the Operator trousers too. Again, the stitching is perfect, and the cut is FAR better than China clones. They’re about half the weight of the Emerson ones, so they’re cooler. Knees are adjustable, and sewn in the right place (Emerson is offset slightly) there’s pistol mag pouches inside the pants with a rubber retention lip. There’s enough adjustability and features to do a 20 page review on them, but the best way I can describe them is this..

 

dont look at them as expensive. Look at them as 95% as good as Crye, for 50% of the price. I love mine. I bought cheap clothes and plate carriers to start, and while they worked, they didn’t fit perfect, rubbed, rode up and down and were just generally sufficient, but not ideal. The clawgear/ Warrior assault systems stuff I throw on now are perfect and will last me a lifetime. 

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54 minutes ago, Wo1f said:

they are issued to some militaries apparently

 

Which ones?

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14 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

Which ones?

Dunno, just what I’ve heard. A quick google says it’s issued to a European special forces group. Doesn’t specify who, and to be honest, I couldn’t care less. I’ve not seen a great deal of Crye stuff in person, but what I have seen, the Clawgear stuff is comparable. Perhaps someone like @CKinnerley will be able to offer a more definitive comparison.

 

 

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I’ve got a genuine frog AOR2 shirt (bought very cheap of a French guy on fleabay who periodically pops up with real ex-SF kit for sale ) plus numerous other grades of ‘quality’ ubacs and hands down the frog one is the best feeling out of all of them it’s really comfortable to wear and I think could wear it for days before it starts feeling mank . Now the MTP ubacs I’ve got does feel nice to wear BUT it’s nowhere near the quality of the frog . So I’d say yes there is a fair bit of mark up but a fair bit of the high price for the ‘premium’ kit is justified .

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When people get this idea, not even a mountain of evidence will change their minds, I've been at this game 12 years and seen this same thing more times than I can count.  I stopped trying to convince people of anything on this subject long ago because if you lack the knowledge of materials, finishes, labour, manufacture techniques etc that are specific to military gear (the high end stuff specifically); 90% will never get it and can't be bothered to invest the hours needed to actually research how gear is made/what it's made from.  I don't blame them either, if you're not in to it then it's literally the most boring subject in the world.  But the fact you can't be bothered to do the research doesn't change your words from wrong to right by magic.

 

The notion is hilarious that airsofters who play what is regarded by wider society as a stupid childs' game somehow know so much more about the topic than actual military professionals; by which I mean the real professionals at the top end of the game who really give a shit about doing things right and the logistics people who sort them out with kit; not navy dentists or air force chefs.  I'd never deny that the military does overpay for a lot of things and I've also lost count of the times I've personally recommended people buy surplus MTP etc because it represents the best value for this game.  However if you think the end-result eBay pricing of surplus MTP has any bearing on/relation to the pricing of Crye or their ilk, you are ignorant of the facts and need to go away and educate yourself before engaging in conversation on the topic.

 

I'll reiterate again just before someone blows a lid - I'd never tell anyone to spend £300 on trousers for airsoft, unless they happen to have a salary in 6 figures perhaps.  But the fact it doesn't make general 'sense' for airsoft is not connected to the fact that it is incredibly expensive in many, many ways to manufacture gear to the standards that SOF require (and would be highly beneficial to many folks in military service on deployment).  A lot of people also seem to see a price online for some camo kit and just instantly get cost-offended at the mere existence of the item, even though the maker of that item is most likely categorically not marketing their product towards the game of airsoft, they have a totally different customer in mind.

 

As a very, very brief primer to the basic sort of learning you need to under take to being to understand these things I'll just provide this link which people can choose to go over if they so desire - https://primaryandsecondary.com/what-is-quality/

 

If you can't get through even that then sure you can still be part of the conversation, it's just that your words carry absolutely zero weight of credibility and your opinion has no objective worth.

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I guess it depends also on how often you play and how hard.  I usually pay about £15 for camo trousers from eBay and prefer to have lots of differnt ones than to spend the same amount on just one pair.

 

I don't play hard as I am not fit enough, so I think these will last a long time.

 

Cheers


G

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4 hours ago, E21A said:

 

 

Thanks for not answering the question Captin Butthurt 😉😂

 

Same. I just don’t get what they use to justify the cost? 

Bear in mind the MOD will order thousands in one go, maybe even tens of thousahds, so economies of scale will apply, though they probably get ripped off.

 

For the airsoft stuff a run might be a couple thousand at a time, maybe even less.  But I've not paid more than £20 for an UBACs, again rather have variety than spend the budget on just one.

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1 hour ago, MisterG said:

Bear in mind the MOD will order thousands in one go, maybe even tens of thousahds, so economies of scale will apply, though they probably get ripped off.

 

For the airsoft stuff a run might be a couple thousand at a time, maybe even less.  But I've not paid more than £20 for an UBACs, again rather have variety than spend the budget on just one.

 

The stuff the MOD buys is generally at the lower end of quality also. 

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And also remember ,basically all army kit was supplied by the lowest bidder ! 🤣

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Nothing is more expensive than replacing items you'll never use again because its not good enough for your any more.

 

Clothing mostly comes down to comfort, and better costs more. Better quailty materials/production means you buy it once.

 

When I say comfort, I mean within the elements. So I'm referring to things like level of

- wind proof, breathability,  drying times, resistance to water, how well it keeps you hot/cold, weight, whats it like to wear for extended time

 

The problem is, the appreciation of quality only comes from bad experiences with inferior products.

 

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On 07/07/2018 at 22:52, CKinnerley said:

When people get this idea, not even a mountain of evidence will change their minds, I've been at this game 12 years and seen this same thing more times than I can count.  I stopped trying to convince people of anything on this subject long ago because if you lack the knowledge of materials, finishes, labour, manufacture techniques etc that are specific to military gear (the high end stuff specifically); 90% will never get it and can't be bothered to invest the hours needed to actually research how gear is made/what it's made from.  I don't blame them either, if you're not in to it then it's literally the most boring subject in the world.  But the fact you can't be bothered to do the research doesn't change your words from wrong to right by magic.

 

The notion is hilarious that airsofters who play what is regarded by wider society as a stupid childs' game somehow know so much more about the topic than actual military professionals; by which I mean the real professionals at the top end of the game who really give a shit about doing things right and the logistics people who sort them out with kit; not navy dentists or air force chefs.  I'd never deny that the military does overpay for a lot of things and I've also lost count of the times I've personally recommended people buy surplus MTP etc because it represents the best value for this game.  However if you think the end-result eBay pricing of surplus MTP has any bearing on/relation to the pricing of Crye or their ilk, you are ignorant of the facts and need to go away and educate yourself before engaging in conversation on the topic.

 

I'll reiterate again just before someone blows a lid - I'd never tell anyone to spend £300 on trousers for airsoft, unless they happen to have a salary in 6 figures perhaps.  But the fact it doesn't make general 'sense' for airsoft is not connected to the fact that it is incredibly expensive in many, many ways to manufacture gear to the standards that SOF require (and would be highly beneficial to many folks in military service on deployment).  A lot of people also seem to see a price online for some camo kit and just instantly get cost-offended at the mere existence of the item, even though the maker of that item is most likely categorically not marketing their product towards the game of airsoft, they have a totally different customer in mind.

 

As a very, very brief primer to the basic sort of learning you need to under take to being to understand these things I'll just provide this link which people can choose to go over if they so desire - https://primaryandsecondary.com/what-is-quality/

 

If you can't get through even that then sure you can still be part of the conversation, it's just that your words carry absolutely zero weight of credibility and your opinion has no objective worth.

That was a really interesting read.

Do you, by any chance, have links for further reading please?

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Yes.. my whole blog 😆  ha, no I don't know of any specific articles per se off the top of my head tbh.  ITS Tactical has some great pieces in their archive that are along similar lines and I've written for them recently on the subject of uniforms; so browse through their blog back catalogue in the 'GEARCOM' section.  I personally like The Reptile House Blog for gear reviews and I talk about a lot of details myself on thefull9.net if you scroll back through there.

 

Generally the actual 'how it's made' in terms of tac gear is not something that's in demand enough to generate one specific site/channel/blog so it's all scattered around in various videos and small articles about how the truly quality companies pour time and effort in to manufacturing and designing stuff.  If you look around for things talking about Crye and Arc'teryx you may find some more.

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Yeah the amount of money people are prepared to spend on clothes is staggeringly retarded.

 

tdVBPO3.jpg

 

This god awful creation? £1600

 

All of a sudden £70 for a UBACS dont seem so bad :P

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1 hour ago, Tiercel said:

Yeah the amount of money people are prepared to spend on clothes is staggeringly retarded.

 

tdVBPO3.jpg

 

This god awful creation? £1600

 

All of a sudden £70 for a UBACS dont seem so bad :P

 

FACK!!! 😳😳😳

 

Money sure doesn’t buy taste does it!? 

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Would rather see someone wear an UBCAS to the shops rather than that tbh

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