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Duff

Armed Police - Yes or No

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10 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

"Officer"?

 

This is mostly a UK forum, where anyone close to being an "officer" would say "warranted constable."

 

But you do you.

 

 

My friend is currently a "Temporary Sergeant".

He gets a lot of stick for the temporary part.

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1 hour ago, L3wisD said:

 

My friend is currently a "Temporary Sergeant".

He gets a lot of stick for the temporary part.

 

My brother is a temporary adult, spends all his time at work playing on RIBS, launches, jet-ski’s and saving Navy bomb disposal experts lol

He’s driving this one :D

hQdLyoE.png

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7 hours ago, Duff said:

Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe PO's carry pepper spray as thread issue right?

PAVA is current issue in West Yorkshire. The old CS spray was vicious stuff that had a cloud effect so everyone got a dose. PAVA only affects the subject (it works in small amount too as I "accidentally " took a hit at work .... 

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Technically speaking pepper spray in whatever form is also classed as being armed is it not?

 

If you are caught with pepper spray (again in any form) its classed as carrying an offensive weapon and could land you in bother for common assault if you used it as a member of the public? So from that rationale even a police officer carrying spray is "armed" same rational would go for having an ASP...?

 

I'm well aware of the vast differences between firearms and sprays/batons but if you're prepared to spray someone or give their appendages a bashing (suit you sir) why not have the option of less than lethal firearms for all police (baton rounds for example)...?

 

 

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13 hours ago, Rogerborg said:

 

"Officer"?

 

This is mostly a UK forum, where anyone close to being an "officer" would say "warranted constable."

 

But you do you.

 

 

Never heard anyone from the UK say warranted constable in my entire life

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Do you think arming standard Bobbys with a 9mm handgun would increase or deter people from joining up? And do you think it would encourage current PO's to resign.

 

I definitely think it would lead to more illegal firearms and shootings if it happened. 

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10 minutes ago, Duff said:

Do you think arming standard Bobbys with a 9mm handgun would increase or deter people from joining up? And do you think it would encourage current PO's to resign.

 

I definitely think it would lead to more illegal firearms and shootings if it happened. 

 

Tbh I don't think it'd make much difference in the numbers of people applying, but I do think you'd start to attract a different type of person applying.

 

I do also think it'd encourage existing officers to resign.

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4 minutes ago, steakandpotato said:

 

Tbh I don't think it'd make much difference in the numbers of people applying, but I do think you'd start to attract a different type of person applying.

 

I do also think it'd encourage existing officers to resign.

 

That is a concern of mine too. I've had very few encounters with police, never on the wrong end I'm proud to say. But every time I've needed them they've been nothing but professional and courteous. If I had an armed officer at my door I'd be way more intimidated if I'm honest.

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About 10 years ago I got a chance to install a computerised RFID gun tagging system in 2 Police armouries where I asked a few questions.  Guys there were perfectly happy with the amount of trained officers.  They believed it provided the best balance.  There were always 2 vehicles out on patrol in the county (Kent) which I was surprised, thought would be higher - maybe this has changed now.  1 kit truck.  1 indoor shooting range (this was lovely), 1 force armourer who tested airguns etc with a high-end chrono.  very interesting work.

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2 minutes ago, Duff said:

 

That is a concern of mine too. I've had very few encounters with police, never on the wrong end I'm proud to say. But every time I've needed them they've been nothing but professional and courteous. If I had an armed officer at my door I'd be way more intimidated if I'm honest.

 

Eh, I'm not too sure if I'd feel intimidated just because he's armed. He's still a police officer after all

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I don't think it matters what we think.

 

Its up to the people in the police force to decide what they want and need.

They'll probably want policy changes rather than equipment I would guess.

 

As has been seen in the past with armed response units, the scrutiny they're under after discharging their weapons would be enough to put anyone off and just throw their guns instead.

 

I respect the police for having to deal with the scum of the earth and still keep calm and civilised.

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4 minutes ago, EDcase said:

I don't think it matters what we think.

 

Its up to the people in the police force to decide what they want and need.  Its up to us to support them.

They'll probably want policy changes rather than equipment I would guess.

 

As has been seen in the past with armed response units, the scrutiny they're under after discharging their weapons would be enough to put anyone off and just throw the guns instead.

 

 

 

Of course it matters what we think.

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1 hour ago, Duff said:

 

Of course it matters what we think.

Then I think they should all have M60's and rocket launchers to deal with the scooter scumbags

 

At the very least they should be allowed to knock them off and reverse over them.

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On 4/13/2018 at 11:48 AM, EDcase said:

At the very least they should be allowed to knock them off and reverse over them.

 

I know you're partially joking but...

 

The one thing that really annoys me about the fluffy world we live in... as soon as a scooter rider or motorbike rider starts zooming off pursuing cars have to hold back or call off the chase full stop due to risk of life of the driver especially if the rider isn't wearing a helmet. Yet its fine for said rider to have possibly of just knocked over a jewelry shop with a machete.

 

Personal opinion is that the justice system is so beyond wrapping people up in cotton wool these days its hard to see where people are actually getting justice. 

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I think most of the food groups have been covered here already. I have been trained by and with Police Firearms Officers and can only say that they have a huge weight of responsibility in a force that will throw them to the lions if in a split second, life or death call, they make the wrong judgement.

 

I can fully understand why the majority of cops just aren’t interested!

 

My Dad did armed security overseas and always felt that because he was armed anyone attempting anything where they might come across security would also be armed. I think you would see an escalation similarly in the UK if Police were generally to be armed.

 

Lastly, let me say as a Firearms Instructor of some years experience, not everybody is suitable for a Firearm. Moreover, far fewer people have the ability to pull the trigger on a living target when that moment comes.

 

You can only hope that in that situation you behave in the way you are trained. Nobody that has not been in a life or death situation can be sure how they will perform in that moment. All the Airsoft in the world is no preparation.

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38 minutes ago, Countryman said:

You can only hope that in that situation you behave in the way you are trained. Nobody that has not been in a life or death situation can be sure how they will perform in that moment. All the Airsoft in the world is no preparation.

Who said anything about airsofters carrying guns? Pretty sure the discussion is about trained police officers carrying guns because of the rise in violence.

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2 hours ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

Who said anything about airsofters carrying guns? Pretty sure the discussion is about trained police officers carrying guns because of the rise in violence.

No one. Think you need to read my post again. Not sure how it could be miscontrue.

 

Big difference in playing airsoft to having your life on the line and having to make a life or death decision. Ultimely this is a decision for the police and individual officers.

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47 minutes ago, Countryman said:

No one. Think you need to read my post again. Not sure how it could be miscontrue.

 

Big difference in playing airsoft to having your life on the line and having to make a life or death decision. Ultimely this is a decision for the police and individual officers.

No I read it right and again in your response you bought up airsoft which has no relevance to this thread.

 

It is general discussion nothing more.

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11 minutes ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

No I read it right and again in your response you bought up airsoft which has no relevance to this thread.

 

It is general discussion nothing more.

Yes sure thats why its in the General Discussion category. A general discussion, on an issue ultimately to be decided on an individual Officer basis, who themselves would be forced to make a life or death decision, which experience of airsoft does not give anyone any peculiar insight into. 

 

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1 hour ago, Countryman said:

No one. Think you need to read my post again. Not sure how it could be miscontrue.

 

Big difference in playing airsoft to having your life on the line and having to make a life or death decision. Ultimely this is a decision for the police and individual officers.

 

I started this thread and it is not my iintention to promote airsofters being in any way informed or educated enough to own a firearm. This is about arming the UK police forces.

 

As I started it I can clearly promise this thread has nothing to do with airsoft other than it exists in an airsoft forum. Perfect example of operator wannabes who think being an airsofter gives them any form of experience when it comes to firing a real firearm.

 

I once picked up a doll now I know how to hold a baby - kind of mentality.

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Hi Duff

 

I have no issue with any Airsofter wanting to own a Firearm. Actually to the contrary, find a club, get trained and enjoy! At that point though there becomes a very real line between a real firearm and playing a skirmish.

 

I do think there is a potential for people who skirmish to think they have some kind of empathy with people who do this stuff for real and Ive seen in the past that people can become quite Gung Ho over potential violence. The reality of the situation is some kid with a plastic gun (like above), or some desparate bloke, drunk or high and unable to deal with the breakup of a relationship threatening himself or anyone that comes near with a knife. In the USA both of those situations have ended up with fatalities. In the UK both of those situations have ended up with the perpetrator being arrested alive and getting the help they need.

 

There is a time that peace has to be established by people skilled in violence. I'm just glad that in the UK thats in the hands of a public servent who doesnt feel its needed day to day and can call "highly trained" people when the need arises. (Dont get me started on training gaffs here)

 

I do rue the fact that we dont have 100,000 armed police to secure London like the French did after Charlie Hebdo. Its just not possible with the 2500 authorised firearms officers available to London.

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As I said this thread is about arming the UK police force, not big kids with a penchant for playing soldiers.

 

Thanks for your opinion on that but feel free to start an alternative thread to discuss it further. 

 

Alluding to your comment that guns cause deaths of potential suspects, a guy recently walked into a travel agents and sliced off the head of his ex gf then sat calmly waiting for the police. It isn't so cut and dry, it's always situational.

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How so? Only if an armed officer was immediately present and could have stopped the assailant could this have ended differently. As he sat there quietly to be arrested there was no need for an armed officer.

 

Sure there are times when they are needed but does that mean you want your local bobby/ traffic officer armed?

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3 minutes ago, Countryman said:

How so? Only if an armed officer was immediately present and could have stopped the assailant could this have ended differently. As he sat there quietly to be arrested there was no need for an armed officer.

 

Sure there are times when they are needed but does that mean you want your local bobby/ traffic officer armed?

 

Not personally. But say this guy didn't sit calmly and grabbed a member of the public as a hostage? In that particular situation armed police would be a better response. 

 

Again totally situational.

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Absolutely. If the guy stood in the shop waving the knife about you can be sure the ARV would be there before anyone went in.

 

There are better arguments for arming the police. Look at how the attack on Westminster Bridge/ Parliament was stopped.

 

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