Dentonboy Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 "Damn, I can't use it, it is firing 310 on .3s." "Dude, why did you tell them they were .3s?!" "Erm..." "I always tell them they are .2s." These were seasoned 'milsim' players, with HPA Armalites and GBBs without a care for rules nor the injuries such 'hot' weapons could do. The one who said he doesn't admit to using .3s was a very loud mouth American lad who is apparently in their forces. Disgraceful behaviour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Root Admin proffrink Posted April 17, 2016 Root Admin Share Posted April 17, 2016 Did you mention it to the marshals? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Sitting Duck Posted April 17, 2016 Supporters Share Posted April 17, 2016 Call Users Next Tuesday sometime honestly - that is like getting on for 400fps and the fact they wanna use .30's for either flight or pain - probably both yup I don't think much of ar$eholes like that The one who said he doesn't admit to using .3s was a very loud mouth American lad who is apparently in their forces. I was about to mention a possible yank or suggest he go and play with the high speed high power big boys over the pond soz to any American members out there I don't think all of you are like that twat who ignores our limits Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest PT247 Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 I thought Holmbush were using their own 0.2g BBs for chrono now? I will pass this info on to the chap who runs the site. Wasn't there today as stiched up with working. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dentonboy Posted April 17, 2016 Author Share Posted April 17, 2016 I passed it on to the guy who runs the site...who is a good guy. For example, he gave out about 100+ barrel socks to players for free today. I hope it is a rare mindset, I really do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters ImTriggerHappy Posted April 17, 2016 Supporters Share Posted April 17, 2016 I hope it is a rare mindset, I really do.Unfortunately its not rare enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dentonboy Posted April 17, 2016 Author Share Posted April 17, 2016 Yes, they did use own ammo when chronoing guns today. But I guess this was either a guy checking a new rifle mid game, or they didn't have a mag for his as it was perhaps a GBBR. The owner is one of the good guys for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slick Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 Quick question, my ICS is currently running 360fps on .2g. I thought it had a M100 but it probs m110. The gun was classed as hot at the Mall so had to rent. Now got a chrono to ensure I know what the RIF is running at. I also intend to try out a load of mods ( I'm a tech at heart) Bought a M90 and it runs at 300 which is as expected. Anyway back to the question, 360fps is on zero hop, adjust the hop slightly and it goes below 350. Is this then acceptable to use on a 350 limit site or is this bending the rules? In any case got a proper m100 on the way but thought I'd ask. - please don't burn me ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Sitting Duck Posted April 17, 2016 Supporters Share Posted April 17, 2016 Quick question, my ICS is currently running 360fps on .2g. I thought it had a M100 but it probs m110. The gun was classed as hot at the Mall so had to rent. Now got a chrono to ensure I know what the RIF is running at. I also intend to try out a load of mods ( I'm a tech at heart) Bought a M90 and it runs at 300 which is as expected. Anyway back to the question, 360fps is on zero hop, adjust the hop slightly and it goes below 350. Is this then acceptable to use on a 350 limit site or is this bending the rules? In any case got a proper m100 on the way but thought I'd ask. - please don't burn me ! Would be better to start a new post but a few points... Mall is 340 limit max max limit, normally 330 but no more than 340 a smidge over at 360fps then correct AoE should get you down to about 345-350 which is fine for most sites leave gun pre-cocked overnight to break in the spring.... all springs lose a bit of tension after a few months - pre-cocking is just a way of trying to speed up a possible 10% drop/wear (when guns really drop fps it is most likely a bad seal than a massive spring drop) but best start a thread and we will be glad to assist ya rather than chase ya with pitchforks and torches.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Head Moderator Jedi_Master Posted April 17, 2016 Head Moderator Share Posted April 17, 2016 I overheard a conversation in a shop a couple of weeks ago, two players were discussing a gun firing too hot for their local site. The more experienced one told his friend (who was buying his first gun) to just use heavier BBs to bring down the fps and fix the problem. I think this was more a case of fuckwittery rather than malicious intent to cheat the chrono but either way goes against the airsoft ethos of 'honesty' and shows poor understanding of chrono limit based on 0.20g BB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twice19 Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 Does the BB weight really affect FPS that much? My local site always say that their limits are on .20 BBs, but I always guessed it was for some uniformity. Recently swapped to decent .28's instead of crappy .20 to get a little better performance, didn't think there would be a significant FPS drop though (Got a bag of .2 and a HiCap preloaded for the purpose of Chrono - just to be on the safe side). My ignorance aside, cheating is cheating. Whether it's not taking hits or deliberately cheating the Chrono to use a hot gun - it's not on. Especially if it's something that can cause damage! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hrimfaxi Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 It's this sort of crap that was part of the reason for me to stop gaming for a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest PT247 Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 Does the BB weight really affect FPS that much? My local site always say that their limits are on .20 BBs, but I always guessed it was for some uniformity. Recently swapped to decent .28's instead of crappy .20 to get a little better performance, didn't think there would be a significant FPS drop though (Got a bag of .2 and a HiCap preloaded for the purpose of Chrono - just to be on the safe side). My ignorance aside, cheating is cheating. Whether it's not taking hits or deliberately cheating the Chrono to use a hot gun - it's not on. Especially if it's something that can cause damage! In a word, YES. A 350fps gun on 0.2g BBs should chrono at around 314 on 0.25g BBs, what that heavier BB does though is maintain it's energy for longer which is why we use heavier BBs as it allows them to travel further and straighter for longer (in a simplified explanation). The issue is not the FPS but the energy, at 350fps on a 0.2g BB it have 1.14j a 0.3g BB at 350fps however will have over 1.7j which even for a DMR is "hot" at most UK sites (would give around 430fps on 0.2g BBs). DMRs and bolt action rifles have an MED to reduce the likelihood of serious injury. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Sitting Duck Posted April 17, 2016 Supporters Share Posted April 17, 2016 I was adding about 40fps per extra .05gms 350 on .20's is about 310-ish on .25's so if guy was hitting 310 on .30's it has gotta be about 400-ish on 0.20's at chrono and close up will sting more due to mass of bb - 50% more weight mass or whatever you wanna call it The fact the guy is trying or usually trying to cheat chrono by quite a bit indicates he has no regard for site rules or come to that anybody else's safety We are not talking about a borderline amount just a smidge over that might just drop under the chrono with a whisker more hop But a gun way over - plus in my mind if these guys are running hpa/gas..... Whose to say these f*ckers don't crank up the settings once they get past chrono and into game itself Yes there is various ways to try to cheat chrono, these people would cry their f*cking eyes out if shot with a fresh brand new co2 bulb hitting stupidly hot fps on the first shot or two. Hopefully most players adhere to the guidelines and limits - just hope these twats are few n far between Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snakeeyes75 Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 As of today, my local site (EAG Worthing) has decided to chrono ALL guns every time with the weight ammo used on the field and at the Joule limit, pretty much all guns passed with only a few being a tad over, I was one of about 4 snipers so it's made a bit of an impact although give it a few months and people will swap springs out etc... Felt nice now having that "Hot gun" issue for once! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters jcheeseright Posted April 17, 2016 Supporters Share Posted April 17, 2016 Quick question, my ICS is currently running 360fps on .2g. I thought it had a M100 but it probs m110. The gun was classed as hot at the Mall so had to rent. Now got a chrono to ensure I know what the RIF is running at. I also intend to try out a load of mods ( I'm a tech at heart) Bought a M90 and it runs at 300 which is as expected. Anyway back to the question, 360fps is on zero hop, adjust the hop slightly and it goes below 350. Is this then acceptable to use on a 350 limit site or is this bending the rules? In any case got a proper m100 on the way but thought I'd ask. - please don't burn me ! I always chrono with my hop set correctly, I figure that's how I'm going to use it in game. The chrono measures MUZZLE energy, not spring energy or any shit like that, set the gun up how you will use it and if it passes chrono your muzzle energy is within limits. People who claim you should chrono with hop fully off are morons, though likewise people who chrono with hop fully on to deliberately lower their FPS are wankers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dentonboy Posted April 17, 2016 Author Share Posted April 17, 2016 Just want to stress this isn't a dig from me at HPA or Gas users, at all. If you're clever enough to use such equipment and understand it, you're +1 on me. Was just shocked at such a conversation going on between players who clearly weren't newcomers to the sport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters ImTriggerHappy Posted April 17, 2016 Supporters Share Posted April 17, 2016 Was just shocked at such a conversation going on between players who clearly weren't newcomers to the sport.Thats because the worst players in airsoft are never the new ones its always those that think they are some sort of airsoft operator so normal rules dont apply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dentonboy Posted April 17, 2016 Author Share Posted April 17, 2016 Well, one of the pair in the chat was clearly not going to use a hot gun...it was the brazeness of the guy who casually suggested deception. Makes me sad that we all can't just follow the rules, be it hit-taking, hot guns or staying within boundaries, and just have a good day outside in the Spring sunshine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Monty Posted April 17, 2016 Supporters Share Posted April 17, 2016 Yikes.. The lack of concern from these 'individuals' for potentially severely injuring a lot of people is disturbing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest PT247 Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 Have had a chat with the site owner about this incident even though I didn't play today and he has taken it very seriously. As of today, my local site (EAG Worthing) has decided to chrono ALL guns every time with the weight ammo used on the field and at the Joule limit, pretty much all guns passed with only a few being a tad over, I was one of about 4 snipers so it's made a bit of an impact although give it a few months and people will swap springs out etc... Felt nice now having that "Hot gun" issue for once! Do they use their own ammo at the weight the player states they are using or do they take that persons word for it and use calculations based on the info given by the player? I get the sentiment with going by the weight stated but unless they use site own BBs then this is just as open for abuse as the OP situation. Joule creep is a thing but surely it is far far easier to just insist on chronoing with the sites own BBs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators djben9 Posted April 18, 2016 Moderators Share Posted April 18, 2016 Quick reply as on phone, I was behind a guy at Tuddenham who was checked, he was asked what weight, he said. Msrshall checked reading and chart to advise of fps, not seen that at other sites, so see it as a good thing, 😀, guy was under for the weight he was using, at urban assault, not yet seen similar methods but not to say they don't as not been enough to register it Anyway what's to say people don't pass chrono then swap around before game, what's the point in hurting someone in what's an honest based sport, Charlie uncles then!!, maybe random checking throughout games more often? Ok if will annoy but also if warned before hand can implement a ban if found out later or something similar?? Will just ruin it for others ☹️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dentonboy Posted April 18, 2016 Author Share Posted April 18, 2016 CSW always used to chrono guns as players left the SZ...and I believe they also chrono'd at the range as well. Dog Tag is easily one of the most H&S concious sites I've ever played at, so this doesn't in anyway change how I feel they handle safety issues. Just a shame that such conversations are being had, and for what end? One guy knew his gun would be hot and thus wasn't going to use it, but then his mate encourages him to cheat...so much for an honour game. Good on the guy with the gun for not using it (as far as I could tell). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Root Admin proffrink Posted April 18, 2016 Root Admin Share Posted April 18, 2016 Anyway what's to say people don't pass chrono then swap around before game, what's the point in hurting someone in what's an honest based sport, Charlie uncles then!!, maybe random checking throughout games more often? Ok if will annoy but also if warned before hand can implement a ban if found out later or something similar?? Will just ruin it for others ☹️ Swap what before the game? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters jcheeseright Posted April 18, 2016 Supporters Share Posted April 18, 2016 I'm guessing he means ammo, I'm also guessing he doesn't understand how energy limits are actually calculated either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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