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Jambo88

Israeli loadout

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Hi

 

Just wondering if anyone has made a Israeli loadout?

 

What gun did you go for ? I'm not sure if I should go for a TAR 21 or a M4 type. Also what sort of chest rig is best and where do you find the helmet cover?

 

This is the gun I'm thinking of getting

 

http://airsoftshop.cz/product_info.php/cPath/404_414/products_id/5435

 

But I'm open to suggestions to a decent M4.

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First off, maybe doing an Israeli impression isn't the greatest idea giving current events over there and you could get a bit of stick for impersonating Israeli military. (Just a word of warning, but each to their own and it's all up to you I suppose)

 

However, if you do decide to go for it. I have two words for you, and they are: OLIVE DRAB!

 

Best bet for chest rig is probably some sort of OD plate carrier like a WAS DCS or WAS RICAS, add a few M4 pouches, 3 or 4 Grenade/Smoke pouches and a utility pouch.

 

Try eBay for a Helmet Cover. They are sometimes known as 'Shower Cap' Helmet Covers. In fact, I seen someone selling one on ZeroIn (forgive me for mentioning it Mods) a while ago but not sure if it's still there.

 

Rifle is probably safe with a standard length M4, vertical grip, Holo sight and 2 point sling in OD. Probably something like Classic Army or G&P as they're M4's have good rep. You could even try get a G&G Top Tech M4, but they don't have RS trades if that's the kinda thing you're into.

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If you're feeling flush you could buy a Marom Dolphin or Hagor vest - I'm tempted by the latter but can't justify the cost. For the helmet cover you want to look for a mitznefet

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There are no all round good replicas of the Tavor unless you want to buy an Ares one and replace all the internals- the M4 may be your best bet.

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You could use Zahal.org for Israeli stuff.

I don't really like to support / buy from Israel though

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You could use Zahal.org for Israeli stuff.

I don't really like to support / buy from Israel though

& why is that then..?

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You know...cos they blockade / restrict food into the Gaza strip, bomb / shell civilian buildings and UN hospitals etc etc

 

Israeli "Defence" Force my arse

I don't want warning point's so i'm not going to post the reply i wrote out

 

i shall just say this..if i was to choose who i'd want fighting by my side against IS/taliban i'd pick an israeli soldier over a Hamas militant any day of the week ^_^

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I have looked into all the TAR 21 models and this is my run down:

 

1) Ares TAR 21 - Good externals. Internals are quite a bit custom including hop attached to the gerarbox and other one offs that you'll only find in this gun. Internally it also has faults, the magazine release button is a mess, the motor isn't exactly great and the gearbox is a bit rubbish. All in all its a nice looking gun but not very reliable.

 

2) S&T Explorer TAR 21 - Terrible externals, seams showing top and bottom and the plastic is thin and nasty. Internally its following a similar design to the Ares, only the gearbox is plasitc. Yeah its kind of rubbish.

 

3) S&T Professional TAR 21 - Brand new gun this year. The externals are better than the explorer edition, seams are still showing but the casing is a lot thicker than the explorer and its not so shiny. Internally it now has a metal gearbox, 8mm bushings, quick spring change system etc. Its meant to be a lot better and reviews of it seem to be mostly positive.

 

A couple of weeks ago I bought the S&T professional. I had to get it imported from Hong Kong as its not out in the UK yet. Out of the box it was firing 390 (a tad hot). I used the quick release spring thing and found it has a short spring, which none of the stores I talked to has. I tried an M110 spring and it came out at 390 fps as well because it was too long, but after I clipped the spring which reduced the length, it came out the same as the original spring and produced 345 fps, just perfect for the 350 sites I play at. I fired 2 shots and now I get nothing out of the gun at all afterwards, no response on trigger pull. Stripping it down I have found its got a lot of special little hex keys in there in awkward places, not to mention there is no disassembly guide for this gun anywhere. I think its likely the motor died (its almost certainly electrical), seems the most likely cause although out of the box the wiring looks rubbish ( I have some nicks in the rear wiring showing the internal wiring, it needs repairing) but I am still waiting on some special long allen keys to get to the gearbox. So I wouldn't exactly call it faultless out of the box! Admittedly I changed the spring using the spring change system but it really didn't last more than about 100 shots.

 

So really there aren't any good TAR 21's on the market, the Ares is the only one that looks decent externally, but its kind of rubbish internally. The others are cheaper and either much worse internally or marginally worse. They did fix some of the design faults of the original Ares with the Professional (supposedly) so in theory its the best one to get for faults and such but externally I can't say it looks very good at all and I haven't had any luck with the internals so far!

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Until now ive never heard anything bad about the Ares TAR, i thought internally it was pretty good like most Ares guns (except the Ares special designs which are hard to find replacements for), though i do not yet own one,and may well be proven wrong.

 

Could it just be a bad rifle of the batch or is it a design issue that lets it down?

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Someone at my sight has an Ares Tavor which worked flawlessly out of the box and still does. So basically makes it worth as much as your house.

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Surprised its not been mentioned but how about a slightly older loadout using a Galil? ICS, Kingarms and Cyma all make good reliable guns, bit more interesting than an M4 too (ducks for cover from incoming flak)! Desert Eagle for a sidearm maybe? Or for CQB a UZI? Even an FN FAL or Sterling SMG would be legitimate depending on era. Further back still, when the IDF formed they used pretty much any WW2 guns they could lay their hands on, Stens, MP40s, bolt action rifles etc if such things interest you?

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Someone at my sight has an Ares Tavor which worked flawlessly out of the box and still does. So basically makes it worth as much as your house.

Good to hear, though i expect a 400 pound gun to work that way anyway :P

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Thats a bit below the belt Finius. :P

 

 

Edit : Added smiley so everyone know's I was making a joke.

Edited by TeddyBhoy

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Absolutely. I'm no fan of Israel's politics, but if someone likes their IDF uniforms or the Galil or UZI or whatever, and wants to do airsoft in that gear, then good for them. After all, just because I'm got some black tactical gear and a GBB MP5K doesn't mean I'm about to go and storm the Iranian embassy any more than it makes someone collecting Third Reich stuff a Nazi. You can be into something without advocating the politics behind it. Just don't be seen having a bacon butty in the morning at a skirmish when in that get up, or it'll completely blow your authenticity. :rolleyes:

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I have had the S&T pro apart now and had a good lock at all the guts. This gun is a pain in the backside to strip and rebuild, oh my god! To get to anything everything has to come apart, its not easy to get in there. I can't say if the internals for the trigger, magazine and safety will stand the test of time but the internals of the gearbox is moderately interesting for anyone wanting to potentially get this gun.

 

A few notable things:

- Spring guide is plastic, no bearing. A pretty bad part compared to a decent gun, but because its quick release a real pain to replace.

- Cylinder pretty basic non ported. Cylinder head is plastic and seals poorly.

- Piston is all plastic (nice yellow pretty weak spongy plastic) as is the piston head. The piston head is awful and air seal is terrible because of it.

- Nozzle is plastic, no o-ring.

- There is 2x 8mm bushing but the rest of the gears are sat on steel bearings.

- The gearbox is shimmed but it does not run well out of the box.

- The trigger box is definitely unique, very awkward spring on this thing.

- Tappet is standard black plastic, spring is quite strong.

- Gears are all metal, not great quality but not awful either.

- Its greesed reasonably well on the gears and such. Some greese missing however on the EBB connector.

- The EBB is connected directly to the piston, so as the piston pulls back so does the fake bolt (which is quite heavy and provides some recoil) and as the piston pushes forward there is a catch that smacks into the fake bolt and pulls it forward along with the air. This is why the EBB is so loud on this gun, its metal on metal hitting under the power of the spring. A G&G M4 in comparison with EBB does it using air to push it back and then recycles the air back resulting in a nice clean movement and a minimal loss of power and lower impact on the way the air is pushed out.

- Gearbox shell itself seems pretty strong.

 

Hop unit is all plastic, completely custom design. No idea how well it holds hop settings yet, my guess based on playing with it is probably not well but we shall see when I skirmish it.

 

Having taken it apart, tried the gearbox on its own with power and it not shooting, then getting it stripped, testing the motor on its own (worked) and then the rebuilt gearbox all is working again. Still mid build but looks lie I hadk a gearbox lock that the motor couldn't get past, was a lot of tension in the gearbox when it came apart despite the spring being removed. I'll hopefully get it together, test fire it and skirmish with it tomorrow and then see how it goes.

 

Overall impression is the guns externals =poor, internals = poor to average, air seal and other consistency items= poor. Its no G&G or TM that is for certain, too much rubbish in the gearbox and plastic parts, none of which can be replaced with aftermarket.

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There were two versions of the original Ares Tavor (as they now also seem to have a 'bargain one). The first, with the short barrel and fixed MARS sight was plagued with problems, but there are a few second hand ones out there that have been sorted out. The second version, with the top rail and longer barrel was a far better version, though the micro switch can be dodgy - had mine swapped to a stronger one but I still occasionally get it switching from single shot to full auto on me (default for the swicth is full ...). Gear box is meant to be strong and reliable, but the casing (also bespoke) is meant to be weak and easy to crack if you open it up without knowing what you're doing.

 

One of the key things that causes hate with the Ares Tavor is that you need to near fully take it apart to do anything and it's not straight forwards. I'm too chicken, but when I went to get my micro switch replaced and the gun checked over, I found a few of the local repairers would not touch it because of the hassle factor.

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Since the TAR seems to be pretty poor unless you upgrade I'm gonna avoid it cheers for the heads up. I'm gonna check out the galil, I forgot about that gun anyone know the best make to go for and price?

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I don't want warning point's so i'm not going to post the reply i wrote out

 

i shall just say this..if i was to choose who i'd want fighting by my side against IS/taliban i'd pick an israeli soldier over a Hamas militant any day of the week ^_^

 

I'd want Hamas, having Israel fight on your side means every arab state would side with ISIS. That said, it's not the Israeli soldier on the ground who makes policy and it's him you are portraying. I would however try and do it without buying from Israel.

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I'd want Hamas, having Israel fight on your side means every arab state would side with ISIS. That said, it's not the Israeli soldier on the ground who makes policy and it's him you are portraying. I would however try and do it without buying from Israel.

Do you do the same thing about *Islamic* made items/services..if not your a hypocrite ^_^

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Since the TAR seems to be pretty poor unless you upgrade I'm gonna avoid it cheers for the heads up. I'm gonna check out the galil, I forgot about that gun anyone know the best make to go for and price?

I have the Cyma one, uses their V3 gearbox which is strong and reliable, though had to downgrade the spring as it was firing 400fps ootb, so reshimmed it and relubed whilst at it, and fitted a TM hop rubber. It shoots superbly now.I also semi permanently fitted a 9.6 battery pack in the foregrip as I dislike stick batteries. The new pack fits no problem. The only issue I had was the (obviously unlicensed) trades had been lasered off the receiver leaving bare metal in places, these I touched in with dark grey paint. On the same issue the box lid was turned inside out, inside is a full colour pic of the gun showing the trades!

Otherwise its a great gun, at £170 its virtually half what a KingArms or ICS would cost (last time I checked) so I didn't mind a few small jobs. Like the King Arms the fire selector on the left side is a dummy moulded into the grip, whereas the ICS has it fully functional IIRC, which would be better since the stock folds to the right side across the AK style selector. The supplied hi cap works perfectly,not had any issues at all.

Basically its a good gun if you don't mind a little diy, if money is no object then either of the other 2 will be nicer externally at least ootb.

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Embarassingly I can't work out how to get the trigger back together! Of all the things top trip up on....it has one of the most non standard gearboxes out there and I just can't get this trigger unit back together (its 2 screws, a plate of metal, the trigger, spring and a pin....I mean seriously how hard can it be). I would estimate for anyone used to taking there guns apart they will spend a couple of hours on full strip down and rebuild at least, its quite a lot of work.

 

Now I desperately need to find some pictures of the internals around the trigger so I can put it back together.

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