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ronin677

how safe are Shooting glasses?

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Well as the title says I am interested in peoples opinions on wearing shooting glasses in airsoft. You only get one pair of eyes and I am concerned about bb's finding their way in through the gaps around the edges?

 

thoughts?

 

Cheers

 

Jon

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to be honest, I use a pair of lab goggles from my science department that I nicked. Before anyone rants, they are good quality, and we have tested them from point blank. No scratches or anything. Only wear what you feel is comfortable. For example, for a skirmish I would wear full face mask (have to) but a garden battle is more relaxed. Still, safety always comes first, so make sure whatever you buy, is good quality. High end market = bolle and oakleys. Oakleys are destructible: there are lots of professional videos but just look at this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FvsWd1NoXYo

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This seems to be coming up a lot recently (with a lot of people getting very concerned all of a sudden about the dangers of safety glasses and the 'need' to go full seal), so I'm just going to copy and paste what I wrote on another forum:

 

I can't count the amount of times I've heard real stories about people having their eyes blown out, or even just having their eye get caught a little bit and having their sight permanently damaged, all as a result of not wearing full seal glasses. I can't count the amount of times because you don't need to count to get to zero.

 

Sarcasm aside, I've been airsofting for about six or seven years, including working as a marshal for a lot of that, and have never personally seen anyone have a damaged eye or even close to it (seen a lot of lost teeth though). Oh, and I wear ESS Ice with the RX inserts in.

 

I have to admit that the 'gap' on the ESS Ice is larger than I would like with the inserts in. Tightening up the 'sports strap' does help, but having inserts does give an extra few mm of gap. That said, the BB would have to be coming in from a very specific angle to get into the only 'viable' gap that might have a line on my eye, and that would be coming from straight below and in front. I usually wear a lower face mesh mask below them and the way mine sit adds protection in that area (though the guy who got hit in the eye recently - and is fine now - thinks that the one that got his eye his the top of his lower face mask and ricocheted up into his eye).

 

You can see me wearing mine in the first few seconds of this video, and as you can see there is a visible gap (I didn't really have my strap/lanyard on tight for this game, or my lower face mask) however you're very unlikely to be hit directly from the angle at which you would need to be to go straight to your eye:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HIZI...ature=youtu.be

 

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This seems to be coming up a lot recently (with a lot of people getting very concerned all of a sudden about the dangers of safety glasses and the 'need' to go full seal), so I'm just going to copy and paste what I wrote on another forum:

 

I can't count the amount of times I've heard real stories about people having their eyes blown out, or even just having their eye get caught a little bit and having their sight permanently damaged, all as a result of not wearing full seal glasses. I can't count the amount of times because you don't need to count to get to zero.

 

Sarcasm aside, I've been airsofting for about six or seven years, including working as a marshal for a lot of that, and have never personally seen anyone have a damaged eye or even close to it (seen a lot of lost teeth though). Oh, and I wear ESS Ice with the RX inserts in.

Well now it's 1

http://www.shadowstalkers.org/news-page/man-down-skirmish-mansfield

 

Footage of the events by one of his friends who was with him

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQGaIsJS0yE&feature=youtu.be

 

Since then a friend of mine has come close - ended up with a bad bruise on the nose just by the eye from a ricochet a marshal had a similar scare the same day at the same site.

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Ok. two opinions from me...

 

I've used bio-BB's "for the sake of the environment" and seen these shatter - instantly dumped them all for fear of hitting someone with meshes on and the thing shattering (seeing first hand what can happen to poor grade BB's that I'd paid top Sterling for, I didn't want to risk my eyes with the same so have never gone mesh).

 

I have unfortunately hit someone (in blackout conditions and a million to one shot) that hit the inner gap between open glasses (the guy has marshalled for years with the same glasses) and the BB ricocheed (spell check please) between the inner lense of his protective glasses, and his eyelid - I was on scene instantly to get the guy help and sat with him until he was prepared to go back in - call it guilt, call it respect, I never wanted anyone to feel the way I did so I always go full enclosed goggles (I'm short-sighted so wear contact lenses) and use Sea Drops (expensive for the bottle, but you literally use a drip per lense for half a day - this is what scuba divers use for anti-fog.

 

So I invested £30 in a set of ESS Ballistic goggles with interchangeble lenses (really do make a difference in having the clear, smoked, and yellow - really surprised) - it's the price of an average walk on, but better than hoping a ski mask will do the job.

 

Good luck, and always consider your mouth protection - you might find your choice of goggles then means you can't use your faceguard.

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I'd only wear full seal glasses/goggles such as ESS V12 or Smith Optics Boogie regulator. Mesh is also a viable alternative but I don't get on well with how they interact with light hitting them, likewise some people have issues with fogging using full seal eyepro.

 

There was another thread on this very topic a little while ago that went into more detail so it is probably worth searching for that.

 

It essentially boils down to whether or not you want to take the risk. People can and do get hit in the eyes wearing shooting glasses, that is just a fact. I would never risk it personally but if other people want to then that is their choice. Ends up really being calculated risks: In a similar manner I wear lower face protection in CQB but not in woodland, but at least your teeth can be replaced although I hope to never have to find out the process for doing so!

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I wear sealed mesh glasses. People say a lot about fragments, but to be fair, you are hitting the smallest single target on a human... By design or by luck. Then if that round does hit your eye, it has to be at the right angle from a bad manufacturer, that cracks into small enough bits...

 

It does happen, im sure.... But so does a lot of stuff. I'd be more worried about the drive back and the odds of getting into a car accident...

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Well now it's 1

http://www.shadowstalkers.org/news-page/man-down-skirmish-mansfield

 

Footage of the events by one of his friends who was with him

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQGaIsJS0yE&feature=youtu.be

 

Since then a friend of mine has come close - ended up with a bad bruise on the nose just by the eye from a ricochet a marshal had a similar scare the same day at the same site.

 

I'll keep the count at 0 since I'm pretty sure he's not blinded or permanently damaged (last I heard at least he was on the road to full recovery).

 

He was the guy I was referring to as having been hit in the eye recently. The irony of his situation (and I've actually heard of this happening a couple of more times myself since the incident) is that his injury was caused as a result of wearing other protection alongside his glasses. Him telling this story has had the positive effect of quite a few people adjusting their lower face masks to be 'outside' their glasses however, thus ensuring nothing will ricochet up and under them, so that's a good thing.

 

At the end of the day, as someone else has said, it's a matter of 'calculated risk,' and the more people who play airsoft over the increasing amount of time that it is played means that the odds of someone eventually losing an eye will constantly increase until it does happen (and wearing full seal will certainly lower your risk of being 'the one' over someone wearing shooting glasses). However, given the literally millions of man hours of play time within airsoft that have already happened, and the fact that nobody seems to know of anyone who has ever 'lost their sight' as a result of playing it wearing shooting glasses, I think that we can say the the risk of losing your eye in airsoft as a result of wearing shooting glasses is still amazingly low.

 

Personally I wouldn't be surprised if the first time we hear of someone losing an eye it's some freak accident in a safe zone or some idiot kid playing in his garden. On the plus side, if you are 'the one' to start the 'I lost my eye at airsoft' trend, eye patches are cool! New loadout:

 

metal-gear-solid-snake-and-big-boss-pixe

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I wear shooting glasses (ESS Crossbow), have done for a long time and will continue to do so. The ONLY time I've ever had a BB inside of them was as a direct result of a poorly fitting lower mesh mask (which I have now ditched). The BB hit the top of the mesh and ricocheted up under my glasses leaving a small bruise under my eye. I believe the exact same thing happened to the guy in the thread dapprman linked and I honestly believe you're safer with shooting glasses and a gum shield than you are with shooting glasses and mesh.

 

As for BBs finding their way through the gaps around the sides and bottom, while it is possible, it's pretty unlikely, not only that they'll have needed to bounce at least twice before they can actually get to the eye if your glasses fit properly. BBs are low energy projectiles, a direct hit on a completely unprotected eye will do some serious damage (I know this first hand having shot a friend in the eye in a freak accident), but ricochets use up a lot of energy.

 

As for bio BBs being lower quality or less safe than normal plastic ones? Hogwash, blasters shatter, pro balls shatter, marui BBs shatter, G&G BBs shatter, madbull shatter. All BBs will shatter if they hit something harder than them at the right angle, if anything I'd say that certain brands of bio BB (green devil in particular) are less likely to shatter as they contain no air bubbles.

 

Airsoft is becoming massively risk averse because of people doing the 'what if' dance. A fine example of that is in the 'did I do the right thing' thread where someone is suggesting that an airsoft gun at point blank could potentially inject air into a VEIN OR ARTERY (what the actual fuck?) based on their limited knowledge of biology and their perception of how high the air pressure in their gun is. It only takes a few chinese whispers for that to change from "this could happen I think, my science teacher told me..." to "gas pistols can kill you if you shoot a vein!".

 

In short, if you're playing in woodland (CQB I recommend full face!) then shooting glasses that fit you properly are perfectly safe providing you don't add in a platform from which BBs can ricochet under/around them (e.g a poorly fitting mesh mask).

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Lots of great answers guys. I will probably go with my shooting glasses or these glasses (see photo), and for my teeth I've decided to wear a gum shield.

 

Thanks for the comments. Lots to consider and at the end of the day it all comes down to risk, which I'm sure I can mitigate :)

 

cheers

 

Jon

post-9602-0-55610100-1402739454_thumb.jpg

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@ Longshot - agreed it's a calculated risk - all depends on how you want to protect your teeth. I've never got on with gum shields (and you'd need both upper and lower) so rely on a mask - especially for CQB. It had crossed my mind to use a shemagh or some thing similar if I'm going to be just woodlands and at range.

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If you have an Athens account and are that way inclined, there is a lot of studies on airsoft trauma and particularly eye injuries. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23654010

 

This one in particular is interesting:

 

 

 


Ocular injuries caused by airsoft guns - ten-year experience.
INTRODUCTION:

The study describes ocular injuries caused by airsoft guns pellets, type of these injuries and their incidence in different age groups.


METHODS:

This is a retrospective review of medical charts of patients who were hospitalized due to airsoft guns ocular injuries in ten-year period (from 2000 to 2009). Patient's age, gender, duration of hospitalization, type of treatment and initial and final visual acuity were analyzed.


RESULTS:

Overall 92 patients with ocular injuries caused by airsoft gun pellets were hospitalized in ten-year period. In all patients only one eye was injured and there were 72 (78.3%) male patients. Injuries involved ocular adnexa, anterior and posterior segment of the eye. On initial examination 41 (44.6%) patients were presented with subconjunctival hemorrhages, 42 (45.6%) with corneal abrasion, 42 (45.6%) patients had corneal edema, 6 (6.5%) had traumatic mydriasis, 90 (97.8%) patients exhibited hyphema, 10 (10.9%) iridodialysis, in 27 (29.3%) patients high intraocular pressure (IOP) was measured, one patient had subluxation of intraocular lens (IOL) and one patient had traumatic cataract. Posterior segment findings included vitreous hemorrhage in 3 (3.3%) patients, retinal hemorrhage in 15 (16.3%) patients, retinal edema in 35 (38.0%) patients and one patient had globe rupture. Average duration of hospitalization was 5.7 days (range from 1 to 18 days). Three patients (3.3%) required eye surgery, eight patients (8.7%) had anterior chamber washout while rest of the patients were conservatively managed. Visual acuity at hospital release was significantly improved comparing to initial visual acuity, ranging from counting fingers at 1 meter to 20/60 in 7 (8.6%) patients, from 20/50 to 20/30 in 13 (16.0%) patients and from 20/25 to 20/20 in 61 (75.3%) patients. In 11 patients testing the visual acuity was not possible because of their young age.


CONCLUSION:

Injuries attributed to airsoft guns were confined mostly to anterior segment. There was also high percentage of severe posterior segment trauma requiring hospital admission. The most important factors in preventing such injuries are restricting access to airsoft guns, especially to minors, as well as mandatory use of protective equipment such as protective eyeglasses.

 

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^ That's very interesting actually. I took a quick look at the site but was still a little confused, could you work out what country that study is from? I was getting Yugoslavia into Serbia? Basing that on the people who carried out the work.

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Also that seems to point towards that they were not airsoft players as it says

 

"The most important factors in preventing such injuries are restricting access to airsoft guns, especially to minors, as well as mandatory use of protective equipment such as protective eyeglasses."

 

So sounds like young uns getting shot in the eyes rather than airsofters

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Being shot in the eye is being shot in the eye, regardless of whether its shot by a child or a "l33t airsoft operatorz" the trauma is still exactly the same. Nobody is suggesting we don't wear any form of eye pro. I'm just providing evidence and data related to actual eye injuries instead of "this one time" hearsay stories.

 

I cant access the full study as i'm at work, but its a restrospective data analysis and has been replicated multiple times across the globe with similar results. There are 15 studies on Pubmed related to airsoft (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=airsoft) mostly about eye trauma.

 

Interestingly the majority are discharged with a visual acuity of 1 (which means 20:20 or normal vision), suggesting that although there are some cases of serious eye injuries, the majority don't suffer any permanent sight loss.

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I use t-Rex shooting glasses with prescription insert.

 

Only had one near miss with them when an Noob ND'd and the BH lodged I between the main lense and the insert.

 

Still use them and for 25 quid they are a bargain. Tested with my old bar10 at 507FPS.

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I had a near miss last night with goggles. The round hit the nose piece of my lower mesh mask and hit into the rubber around my nose. It pushed my goggles up and squeezed underneath my goggles and I felt the last of its energy on the inside of my eye. Didn't do any harm to my eye, just a minor contact on my nose where it came through. But without that rubber stopping that round coming up it would have hit my eye full force, as it was that was scary enough.

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As I said earlier, I don't rate the goggles/glasses and separate lower mesh option. There's a built in gap which just strikes me as asking for trouble if it's not fitted perfectly.

 

Full face or glasses for me, no in between.

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hehe gum shield sorted :D

post-9602-0-48288300-1402923046_thumb.jpg

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As I said earlier, I don't rate the goggles/glasses and separate lower mesh option. There's a built in gap which just strikes me as asking for trouble if it's not fitted perfectly.

 

Full face or glasses for me, no in between.

 

There is no gap in mine, I have custom cut my lower mesh mask to fit perfectly underneith my goggles. If the BB had not struck the mask it would have struck my nose and been on a similar trajectory. The force of the BB moved my goggles and forced its way in through the rubber, thankfully most of the energy was lost in the process. I am however considering permenantly attacking the goggles and the mask together for ease of use and in the process I will also completely seal the area above my nose sealing it not just by the rubber of the goggles but also with the mesh mask and the seal to the goggles above it.

 

My lower mesh mask is not at fault here, it stopped a much worse impact directly on my nose and turned it into an indirect one deflecting a lot of the energy. What it does show however is that the goggles need to be on tighter and fully sealing the lower mask would increase the defence in an otherwise very weak area of every eye solution.

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