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Baz JJ

Why Do Players Buy Two Tone Guns

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Is it just because they cannot wait the two months to become registered or am I missing something?

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There is a misconception that under 18s cannot own RIF's, for one thing. Then there's the problem that u18s can't legally buy any airsoft guns so they must have them gifted - most often by a parent who is not UKARA registered.

 

oops that should be a 'whom'

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That's basically my situation. I'm under 18 so I can't buy an RIF and my parents don't skirmish, so I'm stuck with two-tone guns for two years :(

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Thanks all. Pretty obvious when I think about it.

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Reading the VCRA, as long as you have a valid defense you can manufacture an RIF, so if you are a member of an site that is for example registered with UKARA, then you would have a valid defense. so I don't believe you are stuck with two-tone for as long as you think! But please contact an Moderator before you do anything (just in case I'm talking out of my arse!)

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sod the moderators, if you want legal advice contact a solicitor!

though I believe you are correct, as long as you can avail yourself of the 'skirmisher's defence', by that I mean you can PROVE you're a regular skirmisher (you don't even need to be a site member, though it helps!), then my understanding is that you can legally manufacture a RIF.

 

Though as above, if in doubt, seek professional advice.

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That's basically my situation. I'm under 18 so I can't buy an RIF and my parents don't skirmish, so I'm stuck with two-tone guns for two years :(

Not quite true. You can not buy an airsoft gun and your parents can only buy you a two-tone -BUT... if you are a regular skirmisher at a site that has third party insurance you will have a valid defence and then the VCRA does not stop you from either painting your two-tone or replacing the coloured parts with black etc to make it a RIF.

 

Some sites have taken this further and will allow parents to buy a RIF once their son/daughter has completed their three games over not less than two months. Some people say they are wrong but the sites make no secret about this and it is their business that would be at risk if they have got it wrong!

 

Having siad this, you should check with your local site before turning your two-tone into a RIF just in case they have any rules that would stop you using your gun there.

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Not quite true. You can not buy an airsoft gun and your parents can only buy you a two-tone -BUT... if you are a regular skirmisher at a site that has third party insurance you will have a valid defence and then the VCRA does not stop you from either painting your two-tone or replacing the coloured parts with black etc to make it a RIF.

 

Some sites have taken this further and will allow parents to buy a RIF once their son/daughter has completed their three games over not less than two months. Some people say they are wrong but the sites make no secret about this and it is their business that would be at risk if they have got it wrong!

 

Having siad this, you should check with your local site before turning your two-tone into a RIF just in case they have any rules that would stop you using your gun there.

Currently, the main site I go to (Viking) is insured but isn't part of the UKARA scheme. I have created a cover for my IF so if people bitch and whine, I can just take it right off.

 

I was only referring to about me getting a two-tone and I know that some sites do offer the "junior membership" thanks to the many loopholes but surely because when an over 18 buys an RIF before it is "gifted" doesn't it mean they need their defence as it is going to be their gun for like a couple of seconds?

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But even owning it for a second is possession of a Realistic Imitation Firearm without a valid defence, so there is scope for prosecution. It would be playing with fire if you are a retailer and the person purchasing would loose both the money and the RIF

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Posession isn't a crime, selling to someone without a defence is the crime. Retailers won't give a monkeys about your personal situation as regardless of how long the person will own the gun they'd still be selling a RIF to someone without a defence.

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If so, then technically you could go to a UKARA registered mate with your IF and separate black parts for it, 'gift' it to him, he installs the black parts, then 'gifts' it back to you. That would work, right?

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TacMaster, I never thought of that! :)

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Well technically yes, as long as no goods or services are traded then as long as the person manufacturing the RIF had a legitimate defence

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Well yes but also hiring helps you make a more informed choice, when a site chooses a gun to use for hire it has to be reliable, relatively cheap, skirmishable right out of the box and able to take abuse! Which is also what you want with a starter gun.

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If so, then technically you could go to a UKARA registered mate with your IF and separate black parts for it, 'gift' it to him, he installs the black parts, then 'gifts' it back to you. That would work, right?

technically yes, though that's not really entering into the spirit of the admittedly poorly worded law.

 

It's very very simple to get yourself a recognised defence so why do people insist on trying to find ways around the VCRA?!

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technically yes, though that's not really entering into the spirit of the admittedly poorly worded law.

 

It's very very simple to get yourself a recognised defence so why do people insist on trying to find ways around the VCRA?!

U18's that have been gifted iF's?

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that's not getting around the VCRA, being gifted a RIF by someone as an under 18 is completely legal. However an under 18 giving his IF to someone with a defence and them then turning it into a RIF and 'gifting' it back is quite clearly bullish*t and is circumventing the law in a way that while technically 'legal' (ish) would probably not go down all that well with a magistrate.

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In my opinion, there is absolutely no way on this earth that a court of law could ever actually 'do' someone for possession of a firearm if they illegitimately bought it from a mate with a defence, under the guise of it being a "gift".

They might as well just scribble that part of the law out, because how can anyone ever prove that exchange of goods and services actually ever changed hands? If it was done as a bank transfer they could just say it was for something else, like a birthday present, or money they owed them, or whatever. It's always just going to be one person's word against another. Which surely can't stand up to scrutiny and still be considered a 'fair' trial? The law is broken like that, so people are always, obviously going to take advantage of it, to the point where even the people who enforce it are going to accept it. Sure they'll still have to act on it, but they'll think it's as stupid as you.

If the person wasn't acting like a dick with the RIF then there's no issue, 'cos if they weren't acting like a dick, they wouldn't be in court.
If they were acting like a dick, they'd be prosecuted for that, and not for the fact that they faked having been "gifted" it.

It's just stupid.

I could cry with how utterly retarded the VCRA legislation is, with regard to airsoft. Anyone would think airsoft guns were more dangerous than actual firearms.

That said, circumventing it is simply unnecessary, there are a handful of ways for anyone to legitimately get a RIF, regardless of age, so just use one of those methods, instead of dabbling whilst dancing around on the very fine line made of raw stupid, that is the justice system of this country.

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I could cry with how utterly retarded the VCRA legislation is, with regard to airsoft. Anyone would think airsoft guns were more dangerous than actual firearms.

 

I can agree.

Walked into my local countrywide store to buy some work boots. Saw they had a gun corner so went in and had a look.

Plenty of realistic firearms around, including p99s, ppks, revolvers and rugers etc.

 

None of these, despite being very good replicas and firing much higher than an airsoft gun fall under the RIF category and require a valid defense.

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I know, I came into airsoft from casual air gun shooting and was appalled at how stupid it was. I'd had two perfect P99 replicas as air guns, which both fired metal pellets at over 360fps out to about 40m with pretty good accuracy and couldn't believe how idiotic all the airsoft related laws were.

I still can't.

Two tones just shouldn't exist in my opinion, I've said it a million times, but I think they negate the whole point of the VCRA, how can it reduce violent crime, when it openly gives criminally minded mongs the option to forgo all the trust relationship based UKARA stuff and just buy a gun that's half green and some black paint?

Or even, paint a real gun half green to get one up on the Police. It's completely stupid. Especially when, if someone really wanted to buy a powerful, cheap, replica gun to do someone harm, they could just buy one of the air pistols I used to have for less than £100.

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They would yes, which makes two tones even more pointless. The ramifications of having one in public are even the same.

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